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Developers object to market idea
8:46am Friday 4th July 2008
Comments (38)
COMPANIES behind two key town centre developments have objected to a plan to flatten Swindon's market and rebuild on the site.
London firm Clarebrook wants to demolish the Market Hall in Commercial Road and build a pavilion, complete with restaurant, cafes and a coffee shop.
But its grand plan for the site, which closed as a market last autumn, has run up against opposition.
Parkridge Developments, which is behind the scheme at Regent Circus, and Modus, which is developing the area around Granville Street, have both objected.
They say if given the nod the area would have too many eateries, would lose valuable retail space and that it would undermine their projects on nearby sites.
Despite that, council officers are recommending the scheme be approved by councillors at a meeting on Tuesday.
Planning officer Rachael Adams wrote in a report on the scheme: "It responds well to the immediate Wharf Green area and will be a positive catalyst for future regeneration projects.
"The application provides a positive contribution to the regeneration of the town centre and therefore it is recommended that permission be granted."
It is not the first time councillors have been asked to consider the redevelopment of the site.
In January the planning committee deferred making a decision on the plan, so it could first clarify if it meant the town would lose its market.
In February the scheme was thrown out by the committee which said if it was approved it would detract from other regeneration schemes in the area and also because the design was not of a high enough standard.
It was back before the committee in April when the councillors deferred their decision so the firm behind the scheme could improve the building's design.
After considering the new plan the officer said the proposal being put to the council would improve the area's offering and not lead to an over-concentration of one kind of business.
She also said it would complement Wharf Green and turn it into a vibrant evening destination and she said the new proposals were for a pavilion with contemporary architecture.
Your Say YourSwindon Advertiser
Captain Sensible, Near Swindon says...
9:17am Fri 4 Jul 08
Swindon AOK, says...
9:36am Fri 4 Jul 08
This Council is a fool if it doesn't take these objections seriously.
I know which scheme I'd rather have - demolition of a 60s derelict college, a new cinema and shops/restaurants or an eyesore 'contemporary' pavilion by wharf green.
So many 'regeneration' schemes have not materialised before, and now with the credit crunch, can we seriously take the risk of de-railing these two high-profile schemes due to ashort-sighted tactical decision?
I say we must reject the scheme - nothing has fundamentally chanegd since it was rejected earlier in the year!
Frontier(s), says...
9:45am Fri 4 Jul 08
When developers start making blackmail threats about pulling out of certain parts of the regeneration depending on what happens in other parts of the regeneration it means the Council/New Swindon Company have effectively lost control and any 'vision' they might have will ultimately be dictated by the developers.
As Captain Sensible says, with the credit crunch providing the perfect excuse not to do anything, developers have an even stronger hand at the moment.
And, of course, there's always the very real risk that the credit crunch is actually more a reality and not just an excuse - in which case we can kiss goodbye to any meaningful regeneration of Swindon for several years.
BTW, why hasn't work started on the old college site? It's been derelict for years and is a massive eyesore. I thought planning had been agreed ages ago?
emmylou83, Stratton says...
9:50am Fri 4 Jul 08
Frontier(s), says...
9:56am Fri 4 Jul 08
I wonder how much of our money Swindon Council paid New Swindon Company to pay one of their 'associates' to knock up that little doozy?
Robert Feal-Martinez, Swindon says...
10:00am Fri 4 Jul 08
Harry, says...
10:17am Fri 4 Jul 08
Another year passes. Another year sees Swindon slip further behind its neighbours. The population of a town the size of Swindon should not have to get in their cars and drive an hour up the road to find good quality shops, restaurants and theatres. Where did it all go wrong?
Robert Feal-Martinez, Swindon says...
10:30am Fri 4 Jul 08
Captain Sensible, Near Swindon says...
10:31am Fri 4 Jul 08
Frontier(s), says...
10:51am Fri 4 Jul 08
Robert Feal-Martinez wrote:RFM is entirely correct.
New Swindon Company
If you and your staff were getting paid millions to complete the regeneration of Swindon, what is the very last thing you would do quickly?
They've currently spent 5 years doing virtually nothing, why might anyone assume they're in a hurry to put themselves out of a job?
Just A Thought, says...
11:35am Fri 4 Jul 08
Russ The Manc, Swindon says...
11:50am Fri 4 Jul 08
The thing is the foundations are there to make Swindon a nice place to live and work but as you say they talk a lot but do nothing, I have lived here 9 yrs now and nothing has really changed just pulled down building's and put up white boarding's its shame.
Captain Sensible, Near Swindon says...
11:55am Fri 4 Jul 08
Russ The Manc, Swindon says...
12:25pm Fri 4 Jul 08
Captain Sensible, Near Swindon says...
12:39pm Fri 4 Jul 08
Frontier(s), says...
12:55pm Fri 4 Jul 08
Unfortunately, we've had too many councils who've simply chased thousands of new, cheap houses and lured thousands of low/average paying corporate companies here.
The 'selling' point has always been:
'Cheap labour for businesses'
'Cheap houses for people who don't earn much'
The problem with that is that only companies that offer cheap goods and services are attracted to come here - hence the town centre is so appallingly outdated and depressing.
Add to that the above average number of large council estates, the destruction of the only nice areas in Swindon (by over-development) and you have the situation we have now.
Various council have squandered the opportunities and potential of this town and, so far, they seem content to simply hand our money to the New Swindon Company who then sit around dragging their heels because actually regenerating the place would see them out of a job.
The main problem with all of this is that far too many people seem to want to pretend Swindon's 'great', which lets the council off the hook and ensures the town never moves forward.
Russ is right, most towns of a comparable size up north have had their regeneration completed or well under way.
Bristol, Reading, Birmingham... all have had their city centre/waterside regeneration programmes completed in less time than it's taken our lot to have a few meetings about setting a date to talk about when they might start doing something.
LordBelacqua, Swindon says...
2:02pm Fri 4 Jul 08
The problem with that is that only companies that offer cheap goods and services are attracted to come here - hence the town centre is so appallingly outdated and depressing.
npower anyone? The entire engineering division is based in Swindon, along with the headquarters, on of RWE Trading's UK sites (the other being in the capital, and the UK branch of RWE Power International.
Or perhaps Patheon? Cardinal Health? The UK Research Councils? Arval's headquarters, Lucent Technologies.
Hardly the cheap companies!
Frontier(s), says...
2:13pm Fri 4 Jul 08
The other companies you mention are large corporates who have small centres in Swindon and who don't actually employ many people from the town.
Even so, what I was referring to were the services/retail companies that exist in the town centre, which I thought was fairly clear in the quote of mine that you used.
LordBelacqua, Swindon says...
2:28pm Fri 4 Jul 08
npower anyone? The entire engineering division is based in Swindon, along with the headquarters
Small centres? The Patheon site is one of two and it's only manufacturing centre in the UK.
Most (around 9/10) of npower's headquarter staff live in Swindon, which undoubtedly will encompass a large portion of management.
A decent portion of the Engineering department also live in Swindon (and I should know as I have the pleasure of working with them) - I'm one of the lowest paid in the building at £14k pa (even the security guards get more than I do!)
For the town centre, you have Network Rail, FGW headquarters at the Signal Point building, and Zurich. Swindon town centre doesn't have that much office space to be fair to it, but Swindon is hardly full of cheap companies or "small centres" for admin staff.
Frontier(s), says...
2:35pm Fri 4 Jul 08
Adder, Swindon says...
3:03pm Fri 4 Jul 08
Frontier(s) wrote:The Research Council's are not QUANGO's, they are NDPB's (Non-Departmental Public Bodies). Apologies for being pedantic but I work for them!!
The Research Council is a quango, for a start, and 90% of the employees are admin staff on low/average wages. The other companies you mention are large corporates who have small centres in Swindon and who don't actually employ many people from the town. Even so, what I was referring to were the services/retail companies that exist in the town centre, which I thought was fairly clear in the quote of mine that you used.
BWB, SWINDON says...
3:03pm Fri 4 Jul 08
People will want to come from afar to do
shopping at good retail shops,
Not drink beer,or tea.
which at present as taken over town centre.
Swindon will soon lag behind PURTON.
Adder, Swindon says...
3:05pm Fri 4 Jul 08
Frontier(s), says...
3:06pm Fri 4 Jul 08
Adder wrote:And where do they get the vast majority of their funding from? Ah, yes, the government.
Frontier(s) wrote: The Research Council is a quango, for a start, and 90% of the employees are admin staff on low/average wages. The other companies you mention are large corporates who have small centres in Swindon and who don't actually employ many people from the town. Even so, what I was referring to were the services/retail companies that exist in the town centre, which I thought was fairly clear in the quote of mine that you used.The Research Council's are not QUANGO's, they are NDPB's (Non-Departmental Public Bodies). Apologies for being pedantic but I work for them!!
Call it what you want, they're civil servants.
I know, because I used to work there too!
Frontier(s), says...
3:09pm Fri 4 Jul 08
Adder wrote:Only problem is, the New Swindon Company's reign of demolishion was actually set up and launched under the Labour conrolled Council of 2002.
The Conservative led Swindon Borough Council are succeeding where even the Luftwaffe failed by demolishing vast parts of the town centre and replacing them with absolutely nothing.
Adder, Swindon says...
3:39pm Fri 4 Jul 08
Frontier(s) wrote:Yes, and I have no doubt that if Labour still controlled the Council then the development would now be moving on apace rather than stagnating.
Adder wrote: The Conservative led Swindon Borough Council are succeeding where even the Luftwaffe failed by demolishing vast parts of the town centre and replacing them with absolutely nothing.Only problem is, the New Swindon Company's reign of demolishion was actually set up and launched under the Labour conrolled Council of 2002.
angry monkey, Swindon says...
4:18pm Fri 4 Jul 08
Adder wrote:Yeah because labour ran a tight ship in swindon didnt they?
Frontier(s) wrote:Yes, and I have no doubt that if Labour still controlled the Council then the development would now be moving on apace rather than stagnating.Adder wrote: The Conservative led Swindon Borough Council are succeeding where even the Luftwaffe failed by demolishing vast parts of the town centre and replacing them with absolutely nothing.Only problem is, the New Swindon Company's reign of demolishion was actually set up and launched under the Labour conrolled Council of 2002.
You know, like getting rated as one of the worst councils in the country by their goverments own assesment criteria
Harry, London says...
5:14pm Fri 4 Jul 08
Adder wrote:That is quite possibly one of the most delusional posts I have read.
Frontier(s) wrote:Yes, and I have no doubt that if Labour still controlled the Council then the development would now be moving on apace rather than stagnating.Adder wrote: The Conservative led Swindon Borough Council are succeeding where even the Luftwaffe failed by demolishing vast parts of the town centre and replacing them with absolutely nothing.Only problem is, the New Swindon Company's reign of demolishion was actually set up and launched under the Labour conrolled Council of 2002.
Donkey, Swindon says...
6:17pm Fri 4 Jul 08
I have seen no progress ... even contractors cleaning away the filth would show some kind of movement ... but of course, election time has passed and they conned the public once again to believe in their methods of improvement ... not a chance, too much money going on consultations and the NSCo.
This town gets what it deserves!
Frontier(s), says...
10:57am Sat 5 Jul 08
Adder wrote:Thanks for that - always nice to start a Saturday with a hearty belly laugh.
Frontier(s) wrote:Yes, and I have no doubt that if Labour still controlled the Council then the development would now be moving on apace rather than stagnating.Adder wrote: The Conservative led Swindon Borough Council are succeeding where even the Luftwaffe failed by demolishing vast parts of the town centre and replacing them with absolutely nothing.Only problem is, the New Swindon Company's reign of demolishion was actually set up and launched under the Labour conrolled Council of 2002.
Robert Feal-Martinez, Swindon says...
11:27am Sat 5 Jul 08
Frontier(s), says...
11:44am Sat 5 Jul 08
Cosmo - only if you like Asian/Oriental cuisine.
Parasol - only if you like Asian/Oriental cuisine.
Rendezvous (and it's two or three spin offs) - only if you like Asian/Oriental cuisine.
Fratello's - only if you like Italian cuisine - although it is at least good quality in there.
(and virtually next door to it)
Dolce Vita - only if you like Italian cuisine.
That's about it, apart from the awful 'two meals for a fiver' chain pubs.
Robert Feal-Martinez, Swindon says...
6:21pm Sat 5 Jul 08
Phil, Swindon says...
7:44pm Sat 5 Jul 08
HER_IN_DOORS, Swindon says...
7:51am Sun 6 Jul 08
Captain Sensible, Near Swindon says...
8:09am Sun 6 Jul 08
LordBelacqua, Swindon says...
1:45pm Tue 8 Jul 08
Phil wrote:Oh, what a charming chappy you are.
Having read the puerile comments of Lord B during the last year, I am astounded that someone could pay him £14k a year - I would have thought £4k suited his ability. I agree with the comments about lack of town centre eateries but if we go a little further I can recommend Bottelino's, The Bank, Blunsdon House Hotel and The Schoolhouse
You'll be happy to know I earn my £14K p/a keeping your house in electricity - a rather vital job, wouldn't you agree?
However, you seem very blissful in your ignorance - as you were.
An artist impression of the redeveloped tented market
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Frontier(s), says...
8:55am Fri 4 Jul 08
Just get on and DO something with the so-called regeneration, PLEASE!