Swindon braced for biggest ever strike action (From Swindon Advertiser)

Last step wrote:
Be interested to hear what you two think should be done, rather than the standard, blinkered slating of people actually prepared to stand up for what they feel is right and fair.

abbotboy wrote:
If you dont send your children to school, your fined, so on the 30th every parent should seek compo from the schools and the headteachers can pay the bill......

Mr_Spunk wrote:
Welcome to the real world public sector idiots like your private sector conterparts have.

Sack the lot of them, plenty of unemployed who can do their jobs. No sympathy for them.

Dosomethingmutley wrote:
Cannon fodder for union bosses, who won't lose a penny, to pursue their own political agenda. Not a peep during 13 years of Labour selling the family silver, then because it's the Tories, low and behold the creaky old blaggers start to spout the usual old rhetoric. A majority strike ballot on a turnout of 29% at Unison is not unqualified support, it just looks like 71% of members have more important things to worry about.

blahblahblahblah wrote:
Blind fury, you really arent allowed to leave after 30 years? i think that is slavery, you were making some sense until your emotional drivel about the fact you are forced to work 10 years longer till you retire! sorry but that means you have been getting off very lightly for far too long. no wonder we are all in the sh*t.

towney wrote:
Blind Fury
" Hey, we're gonna make you pay an extra £70 a month, on top of the 11% you already pay into your pension. Not only that, we're not going to let you leave your job after 30 years service, let's make that an extra 10 years for you, and you won't get any more for it....in fact you'll be getting less"

You are not special in this......the private sector have had to make the same changes. It's just that we do not make a huge song and dance about it and get on with it.

And as for your comment... "I doubt there are plenty of unemployed with enough brains to do public sector jobs, hence they are unemployed"....I find that a little harsh, in fact maybe it is you who does not have enough brains....as the last time I checked public sector workers were not only teachers (who do not always have brains) but also street cleaners and the like and they do not need a list of qualifications and would be replaced easily.

And before anyone takes the above the wrong way I think the street cleaners etc do a grand job, I was just proving a point to the muppet.

Swin10 wrote:
I can't leave my job after 30 years of service on a full pension, its always been 40 years service - join the real world!!!

We are all paying more into our pensions as we're all living longer....you're obviously not a maths teacher as your sums don't add up.

Swin10 wrote:
I can't leave my job after 30 years of service on a full pension, its always been 40 years service - join the real world!!!

We are all paying more into our pensions as we're all living longer....you're obviously not a maths teacher as your sums don't add up.

Swin10 wrote:
That's because us "private sector muppets" as you call us understand that there isn't a bottomless pit and are grateful that we have employment in the current economic climate!!
In my company - it has ALWAYS been 40 years service, you're just catching up with the real world at long lost.
The money is not there for you lot to fleece taxpayers further - end of story! The sooner you all wake up and realise that the better for the country. If you carry on going the economy will collapse even further and this time next year money wont be worth anything and we'll be back in the dark ages trading in corn and pigs.

Scott Thunes wrote:
Why on earth is the public sector demonised so, when the real greed is with politicians and the banking sector.

Swin10 wrote:
So how is your public sector pension self sustainable (not sutainable as you have written!) when members of the private sector paid in as much as you do, yet these pension schemes weren't sustainable so they adapted - what planet do you live on? When these pension schemes were dreamed up - nobody thought we'd end up living as long as we now do!

As darkenergy said - we know what the alternative would be if we whinged and quite rightly so! You obviously are not grateful for your job at all, otherwise you wouldn't even think about striking - never heard such a load of rubbish!!

If any of the private companies were run like the public sector - they'd be bankrupt within months.

It's funny how so far you're the only one on your side.....

Blind Fury wrote:
...whilst the rest of us look after you 24hrs a day 365 days a year.

Scott Thunes wrote:
No problem Hmmmf. Your first sentence is telling, as public sector workers are fed up with getting paid effectively less and less as they have to take on more and more with each round of 'efficiency savings' as headcount is reduced and budgets are cut.

And don't forget public sector workers are taxpayers too.

The Real Librarian wrote:
If 7,000 are going to strike, it is because the Union Reps have been bullying people into it - again

Gooey wrote:
Get up stand up! Stand up for your rights

"There are no 'rights' that dictate the public sector must have massive, secure pensions paid for by everyone else."

Scott Thunes wrote:

The Real Librarian wrote: If 7,000 are going to strike, it is because the Union Reps have been bullying people into it - again

Nonsense. Union reps cannot force people to strike, and industrial action guidelines are very clear about 'peacefully' trying to persuade people not to go into work. It's not the 80s any more.

A.Baron-Cohen wrote:
Public sector workers are essential, they are part of the necessary infrastructure allowing any economy to prosper. However, we have got to come to terms with the fact that we are at war, Economic and Financial war, and this is not the time for strikes or petty partisanism. We have to stick together to get through this, or we could well end up like Greece. I appeal for reason, courage and patriotism, The great British Blitz spirit.

Mr_Spunk wrote:
Blind Fury: "I doubt there are plenty of unemployed with enough brains to do public sector jobs, hence they are unemployed" How ignorant of you, what about all those 1000's leaving uni and not getting employment? I bet a monkey could do your job anyway. If your not happy quit your job or stop moaning. Blinded by Fury has got a proper bucking down on this forum! Serves him right too, sack the lot of them starting with this loser.

I 2 Could B wrote:

A.Baron-Cohen wrote:
Public sector workers are essential, they are part of the necessary infrastructure allowing any economy to prosper. However, we have got to come to terms with the fact that we are at war, Economic and Financial war, and this is not the time for strikes or petty partisanism. We have to stick together to get through this, or we could well end up like Greece. I appeal for reason, courage and patriotism, The great British Blitz spirit.

There are c.2.5 million unemployed. The real number is closer to 3m. We're still importing c.300,000 economic migrants every year.

I really don't think there's any shortage of people who'd be more than happy and willing to take up any public sector jobs that the current work force feel is no longer attractive to them.

Gooey wrote:
Alot of those who will strike will have hardly ever seen their union rep. The bully boy tactics are very rare i'm sure. It's an old arguement anti union people spew,along with those who spit "we pay for your pensions" to public workers.

mcd wrote:
I've seen some seriously stupid comments from both sides in this but i think that one point that needs clearing up is that the private sector does not pay public sector pensions (adsinibiza).
People who pay tax give money to the government who pay public sector pensions and funnily enough both the public and private sector staff pay tax.

scottwichall wrote:

mcd wrote:
I've seen some seriously stupid comments from both sides in this but i think that one point that needs clearing up is that the private sector does not pay public sector pensions (adsinibiza).
People who pay tax give money to the government who pay public sector pensions and funnily enough both the public and private sector staff pay tax.

A reasonable point MCD, however, money must first be extracted from the productive sector of the economy (goods/manufacturing

/services/banking) to then be paid to the public sector.

Whatever money is then paid as tax/pensions etc has its ultimate source in the productive sector.

So really, you could infer that not only does the private sector pay for the public sector pensions, it also pays for the tax paid by the public sector employees, and any goods and services consumed by public sector employees.

:-)

scottwichall wrote:

mcd wrote:
I've seen some seriously stupid comments from both sides in this but i think that one point that needs clearing up is that the private sector does not pay public sector pensions (adsinibiza).
People who pay tax give money to the government who pay public sector pensions and funnily enough both the public and private sector staff pay tax.

A reasonable point MCD, however, money must first be extracted from the productive sector of the economy (goods/manufacturing

/services/banking) to then be paid to the public sector.

Whatever money is then paid as tax/pensions etc has its ultimate source in the productive sector.

So really, you could infer that not only does the private sector pay for the public sector pensions, it also pays for the tax paid by the public sector employees, and any goods and services consumed by public sector employees.

:-)

robertfm wrote:
I think you will find basic rate tax is 22%, and even the unemployed have to pay VAT.

Grimsbygal wrote:
I fully support the public sector in sticking up for themselves against this attack from the Government. They are just trying to recoup money from somewhere and the Public Sector is there only target. Private Sector workers should shut up and support the Public Sector. If you are unemployed then please feel free to join one of the Public Sector agencies, what is stopping you. Don't go on about it, go and get a job with the public sector. Dickhead's.

Grimsbygal wrote:
I fully support the public sector in sticking up for themselves against this attack from the Government. They are just trying to recoup money from somewhere and the Public Sector is there only target. Private Sector workers should shut up and support the Public Sector. If you are unemployed then please feel free to join one of the Public Sector agencies, what is stopping you. Don't go on about it, go and get a job with the public sector. Dickhead's.

Grimsbygal wrote:
I fully support the public sector in sticking up for themselves against this attack from the Government. They are just trying to recoup money from somewhere and the Public Sector is there only target. Private Sector workers should shut up and support the Public Sector. If you are unemployed then please feel free to join one of the Public Sector agencies, what is stopping you. Don't go on about it, go and get a job with the public sector. Dickhead's.

Blind Fury wrote:

Grimsbygal wrote:
I fully support the public sector in sticking up for themselves against this attack from the Government. They are just trying to recoup money from somewhere and the Public Sector is there only target. Private Sector workers should shut up and support the Public Sector. If you are unemployed then please feel free to join one of the Public Sector agencies, what is stopping you. Don't go on about it, go and get a job with the public sector. Dickhead's.

Cheers Grimsbygal....someon

e who talks some sense at last........Stand up and be counted.....SUPPORT YOUR LOCAL PUBLIC SECTOR WORKERS!!
What you ALL seem to do is put the public sector pensions into the same discussion, just the same as the government do.
When a teacher is paying just 6% contributions and is asked to up it a few percent, why should someone paying 9-11% be asked to do the same??
About time this discussion ended here I think. Nobody here truly understands why we are fighting for our pensions. If they did, there might be some empathy on here. But hey, I'm not asking you for your blessing to protect my future, so stop barracking those that have the backbone to do it!!

THE END xx

The problem with unemployment is that it doesn't pay to work, 31% basic rate tax! + 20% VAT on your hard earned cash, do you call this an incentive?

jackdawson wrote:
ah I2, my dear comrade. I think the point is that the bank bailout was hundreds of times more expensive than even decades of welfare payments or pension contributions and so why should sick disabled and jobless and the public sector have to lose out pay for the 'BENEFITS' paid to the BANKING SECTOR which are never going to be paid back. They are the true vampires of this country. Not the vulnerable pensioners reliant on the welfare state and still unable to heat their homes!

A.Baron-Cohen wrote:

Blind Fury wrote:

Grimsbygal wrote:
I fully support the public sector in sticking up for themselves against this attack from the Government. They are just trying to recoup money from somewhere and the Public Sector is there only target. Private Sector workers should shut up and support the Public Sector. If you are unemployed then please feel free to join one of the Public Sector agencies, what is stopping you. Don't go on about it, go and get a job with the public sector. Dickhead's.

Cheers Grimsbygal....someon


e who talks some sense at last........Stand up and be counted.....SUPPORT YOUR LOCAL PUBLIC SECTOR WORKERS!!
What you ALL seem to do is put the public sector pensions into the same discussion, just the same as the government do.
When a teacher is paying just 6% contributions and is asked to up it a few percent, why should someone paying 9-11% be asked to do the same??
About time this discussion ended here I think. Nobody here truly understands why we are fighting for our pensions. If they did, there might be some empathy on here. But hey, I'm not asking you for your blessing to protect my future, so stop barracking those that have the backbone to do it!!

THE END xx

What most people disagree is to funding public sector retirement when they can hardly fund theirs.
No public sector employee pension should be financed by the taxpayer, your retirement, your responsability.
and that includes all MPs, councillors, judges etc....

A.Baron-Cohen wrote:

Blind Fury wrote:

Grimsbygal wrote:
I fully support the public sector in sticking up for themselves against this attack from the Government. They are just trying to recoup money from somewhere and the Public Sector is there only target. Private Sector workers should shut up and support the Public Sector. If you are unemployed then please feel free to join one of the Public Sector agencies, what is stopping you. Don't go on about it, go and get a job with the public sector. Dickhead's.

Cheers Grimsbygal....someon


e who talks some sense at last........Stand up and be counted.....SUPPORT YOUR LOCAL PUBLIC SECTOR WORKERS!!
What you ALL seem to do is put the public sector pensions into the same discussion, just the same as the government do.
When a teacher is paying just 6% contributions and is asked to up it a few percent, why should someone paying 9-11% be asked to do the same??
About time this discussion ended here I think. Nobody here truly understands why we are fighting for our pensions. If they did, there might be some empathy on here. But hey, I'm not asking you for your blessing to protect my future, so stop barracking those that have the backbone to do it!!

THE END xx

What most people disagree is to funding public sector retirement when they can hardly fund theirs.
No public sector employee pension should be financed by the taxpayer, your retirement, your responsability.
and that includes all MPs, councillors, judges etc....

jackdawson wrote:
and btw what is also magically forgotten is that if you look at jobs of a similar nature in the public and private sector that are semi-skilled or skilled the pay gap is startling. A civil servant for example doing a middle management job would earn roughly 2/3 less than their private sector counterpart for example but have a better pension scheme which doesn't make up for the loss but softens the blow. One of the only saving graces of working in the public sector and getting low pay was that you would have a decent pension - now that's threatened and I fully support the strikers!

jackdawson wrote:
ah I2, my dear comrade. I think the point is that the bank bailout was hundreds of times more expensive than even decades of welfare payments or pension contributions and so why should sick disabled and jobless and the public sector have to lose out pay for the 'BENEFITS' paid to the BANKING SECTOR which are never going to be paid back. They are the true vampires of this country. Not the vulnerable pensioners reliant on the welfare state and still unable to heat their homes!

Suindone wrote:
Rights do not belong.
Either you fight for them or you lose them.

mitchmitch wrote:
Why punish public sector workers when Vodafone managed to get off paying £6bn in taxes in October 2010? surely £6bn would go a long way towards sending us in the right direction?! I totally support any one striking on Wednesday... as long as you don't go and sit at home and do nothing! go support your cause... go rally!!! Make your voices heard!

darkenergy wrote:
I can only assume that the inability of the strike supporters to grasp the reality of the situation is based on the experience of working for an employer who can't go out of business, because they don't have to compete and can put up taxes or just borrow more, whenever the books don't balance.

doug on the farm wrote:

Suindone wrote: Rights do not belong. Either you fight for them or you lose them.

Quite right!, and these rights have been won by free collective bargaining over many years through organised labour and the trades union movement. If those employed in the 'private sector' feel that it is unfair then they in turn should 'organise'

A.Baron-Cohen wrote:

robertfm wrote:
I think you will find basic rate tax is 22%, and even the unemployed have to pay VAT.

22% PAYEE + 11% NI = 31% tax.

Scott Thunes wrote:

darkenergy wrote:
I can only assume that the inability of the strike supporters to grasp the reality of the situation is based on the experience of working for an employer who can't go out of business, because they don't have to compete and can put up taxes or just borrow more, whenever the books don't balance.

As I've said previously, if the private sector is so terrible, and your perception of the public sector is that it is cushy, then I fail to see why all the private sector hard-done-by complainers haven't made the jump.

Jon1936 wrote:
I don't think we should let this turn into an argument between public and private sector employees.
I feel strongly that private sector pension, especially for shop-floor workers need to be improved dramatically. Infact, when i circulated a petition calling for fair private sector pensions around the school I work in, it was signed unanimously.
The same people that destroyed the private sector pension are doing their best to do the same to the public sector pension. lets not scrap amongst eachother in a race to the lowest possible pay/conditions. as it stands, the governments own report into public sector pensions shows that, even if left unchanged, they are not only curently sustainable, but will get dramatically more sustainable over time.
Also, we live in a time when bankers get bailed out with billions of our money, company directors pay has gone up 50% in the last year and the wealthiest 1000 have made a combined increase in profits of £76.5billion between them.
This shouldn't be about private vs public sector worker, but all of us against the rich b*stards and their tory mates who are sat at the top, laughing at us while we fight amongst ourselves for the scraps from their overflowing table.

p.s - I also think the labour party was a bosses party that did (and does) all it can to sell out working people before we get started on that!

Robfm wrote:
Darkenergy sadly the generic use of the words Public Sector is really not fair. The Police and the Army are public sector employees forbidden by law to 'strike', not that they would anyway.

The Fire, Ambulance Service, Doctors, Nurses and Teachers should be under the same mandate. These are vital services that could affect the lives of people.

darkenergy wrote:
Yes, going on strike is the clever thing to do when we're all in such deep s**t!

plastic 101 wrote:

darkenergy wrote:
Yes, going on strike is the clever thing to do when we're all in such deep s**t!

it about time the public sector shut up and stop crying and trying to hold the country to randsome. I work in the private sector. Where i had to take a pay cut at one stage, two years with no pay rise. then my pension contubutions had to go up from 5% to 8.5% but i had to deal with it. So stop crying and get on with your job that my taxes and council tax pays you for

I don't think we should let this turn into an argument between public and private sector employees.

Robfm wrote:
I think what is perhaps more insulting is that the vast majority who go on strike will treat it as a jolly and go no where near any organised union event.

Wouldn't it be interesting if every pub, club, leisure centre, golf club, shop etc closed it's doors on the 30th. Nowhere for the strikers to go.

mitchmitch wrote:
"Never be bullied into silence. Never allow yourself to be made a victim"
GO STRIKERS!!!! Make your voices heard!

Robfm wrote:
I think what is perhaps more insulting is that the vast majority who go on strike will treat it as a jolly and go no where near any organised union event. Wouldn't it be interesting if every pub, club, leisure centre, golf club, shop etc closed it's doors on the 30th. Nowhere for the strikers to go.

darkenergy wrote:

mitchmitch wrote: "Never be bullied into silence. Never allow yourself to be made a victim" GO STRIKERS!!!! Make your voices heard!

You make it sound like they're fighting a righteous battle against injustice - sadly they're actually taking a day off work and trying to make the lives of the people who pay their wages, and don't enjoy the benefits that they do, even more miserable.

Gooey wrote:

darkenergy wrote:

mitchmitch wrote: "Never be bullied into silence. Never allow yourself to be made a victim" GO STRIKERS!!!! Make your voices heard!

You make it sound like they're fighting a righteous battle against injustice - sadly they're actually taking a day off work and trying to make the lives of the people who pay their wages, and don't enjoy the benefits that they do, even more miserable.

That isn't why they are striking at all. Ridiculous thing to say

darkenergy wrote:

mitchmitch wrote:
"Never be bullied into silence. Never allow yourself to be made a victim"
GO STRIKERS!!!! Make your voices heard!

You make it sound like they're fighting a righteous battle against injustice - sadly they're actually taking a day off work and trying to make the lives of the people who pay their wages, and don't enjoy the benefits that they do, even more miserable.

oldlegtrailer wrote:
Probably will not notice they are on strike - the jobs for life Brigade. Doing nothing all day will be just like a normal day for them. Plonkers the lot of them. If they had to survive in the real world they would die

mitchmitch wrote:

darkenergy wrote:

mitchmitch wrote: "Never be bullied into silence. Never allow yourself to be made a victim" GO STRIKERS!!!! Make your voices heard!

You make it sound like they're fighting a righteous battle against injustice - sadly they're actually taking a day off work and trying to make the lives of the people who pay their wages, and don't enjoy the benefits that they do, even more miserable.

Oh yeah... I forgot that all public sector workers are expected to lay down and take it!! As it has been said on here before, if you are a private sector worker that is not fortunate enough to be able to stand up to your employer, I'm sorry! But don't give public sector workers a hard time for standing up for something they believe in! Support them!!!!!

Scott Thunes wrote:
So what does address the real problem? Public and private sector, hand-in-hand against oppression from above? How is this to be achieved I 2?

I bet all those hedge fund managers out there aren't working till they're 65 or even 60

BeardyBill wrote:
There are some small minded, venomous halfwits posting on this site. I despair that some of you actually really believe the garbage you post, although some of you are obviously wind-up merchants.

I'll be striking on Wednesday. If someone tries to steal from me, I'll stand up and stop them - and what the Government is proposing is theft, pure and simple.

Let's nail some of the lies..."there's no money"....no, it's just a case of prioritisation. We have a government which is happy to spend money bombing Libyans, bailing out the Irish banks, throwing money at the EU etc rather than honouring pension commitments. This is a Government that gives money to business (or at least doesn't make them pay their taxes), because this is a Government that is funded by donations from business. Screw the man in the street, cos. they only get to vote once in every 5 years, and even then most are so apathetic that they can't be arsed to put a cross on a piece of paper. And before all the trolls start, labour have sold out too, and the liberals are nothing more than opportunistic political whores.

To all those in the Private sector who have had their pensions robbed by politicians, greedy companies taking contribution holidays, and rip off charges from the financial sector - I really feel for you. Make a stand, and I'll stand with you...but if you choose to roll over and take it without complaint, then that's your choice. But don't then start to tell me that I can't fight my corner by all legal means, including striking.

And finally....there has been a lot of tripe spoken about the unions not having a democratic mandate to call a strike. Justin Tomlinson was elected on 44% of a 64% turnout....that's only 28% of the votors of North Swindon. It's a similar story for Robert Buckland in Swindon South. As for encouraging participation, anyone can join the union I'm a member off - one member, one vote. Have a look at the Swindon Conservatives website, and you'll find that to join, you have to have a visit from the "membership officer"... No doubt this is to weed out any undesirables.

BeardyBill wrote:
There are some small minded, venomous halfwits posting on this site. I despair that some of you actually really believe the garbage you post, although some of you are obviously wind-up merchants.

I'll be striking on Wednesday. If someone tries to steal from me, I'll stand up and stop them - and what the Government is proposing is theft, pure and simple.

Let's nail some of the lies..."there's no money"....no, it's just a case of prioritisation. We have a government which is happy to spend money bombing Libyans, bailing out the Irish banks, throwing money at the EU etc rather than honouring pension commitments. This is a Government that gives money to business (or at least doesn't make them pay their taxes), because this is a Government that is funded by donations from business. Screw the man in the street, cos. they only get to vote once in every 5 years, and even then most are so apathetic that they can't be arsed to put a cross on a piece of paper. And before all the trolls start, labour have sold out too, and the liberals are nothing more than opportunistic political whores.

To all those in the Private sector who have had their pensions robbed by politicians, greedy companies taking contribution holidays, and rip off charges from the financial sector - I really feel for you. Make a stand, and I'll stand with you...but if you choose to roll over and take it without complaint, then that's your choice. But don't then start to tell me that I can't fight my corner by all legal means, including striking.

And finally....there has been a lot of tripe spoken about the unions not having a democratic mandate to call a strike. Justin Tomlinson was elected on 44% of a 64% turnout....that's only 28% of the votors of North Swindon. It's a similar story for Robert Buckland in Swindon South. As for encouraging participation, anyone can join the union I'm a member off - one member, one vote. Have a look at the Swindon Conservatives website, and you'll find that to join, you have to have a visit from the "membership officer"... No doubt this is to weed out any undesirables.

BeardyBill wrote:
darkenergy, you just dont get it do you?
"The strike is so unpopular with most people, who are being robbed to subsidise your perks..." - actually most people I talk to are quite supportive - the only ones that aren't are the mad, retarded Daily Mail readers, who are conditioned to froth at the mouth at any old rubbish they are told to believe by the media. Luckily, people are starting to wake up and see through the propaganda.

As for you adsinibiza, lets look at what you've written:
"it wasn't the bankers or financial services industry or anything like that the ruined pensions in the private sector" - so you are dening that companies took pension holidays? And why are the annuity charges in Holland around half of those in the UK?

"and the unions did nothing" - Do you know what a Union is? Its a bunch of people who act together....the Union can't do anything without the support of its members. What did YOU do when your pension was robbed? Did you join together with others to defend your pension?

"I and others are calling the unions to account"...erm, you are not. You are just ranting in cyberspace. Loser.

"democratically elected government down on the back of a strike that less than 30% of their membership are in favor of...." - look at the numbers in my last post - if you stand by your claim that the Government is democratically elected on ~30% of the electorate, why is a strike ballot by ~30% of the members any less valid?

You really are a retard.

BeardyBill wrote:
darkenergy, you just dont get it do you?
"The strike is so unpopular with most people, who are being robbed to subsidise your perks..." - actually most people I talk to are quite supportive - the only ones that aren't are the mad, retarded Daily Mail readers, who are conditioned to froth at the mouth at any old rubbish they are told to believe by the media. Luckily, people are starting to wake up and see through the propaganda.

As for you adsinibiza, lets look at what you've written:
"it wasn't the bankers or financial services industry or anything like that the ruined pensions in the private sector" - so you are dening that companies took pension holidays? And why are the annuity charges in Holland around half of those in the UK?

"and the unions did nothing" - Do you know what a Union is? Its a bunch of people who act together....the Union can't do anything without the support of its members. What did YOU do when your pension was robbed? Did you join together with others to defend your pension?

"I and others are calling the unions to account"...erm, you are not. You are just ranting in cyberspace. Loser.

"democratically elected government down on the back of a strike that less than 30% of their membership are in favor of...." - look at the numbers in my last post - if you stand by your claim that the Government is democratically elected on ~30% of the electorate, why is a strike ballot by ~30% of the members any less valid?

You really are a retard.

abbotboy wrote:
Gooey, you say that bully boy tactics were back in the 80s, I worked during a strike two years ago, and still have the dent in my passsenger door from a 'friend' who thought I shouldnt work.......

BeardyBill wrote:
Adsinibiza, do you actually read posts before you launch into a ranty reply?

Firstly, there is no difference in principles - Unions can't force people to take strike action. If my co-workers want to go in on the 30th, that is their choice.

You ask "I have repeatedly laid down a challenge to any trade unionist that cares to pick up the baton - explain why you did nothing to stop Gordon Brown raping the pension pots of millions of private sector workers." - why did the private sector workers who had their pension pots raped not stand up for themselves? Why do you expect the public sector unions to fight your battles for you?

Following your logic, you have been robbed so its therefore ok for me to be robbed too?

I'm no fan of Brown or Labour - again read my post. Labour & Tories - two cheeks of the same arse.

BeardyBill wrote:
Darkenergy, yes we probably do move in very different circles - I mix with people who have a concept of right and wrong, rather than a bitter, twisted race to the bottom mentality.

I didn't avoid the question - the people who will be hurting are the millions of strikers who will lose a days pay - unfortunately, sacrifice in support of a principle is something that I doubt you would ever get your head around.

Who is to blame? The Government had had no intention of negotiating in good faith - how many times have we seen Francis Maude and Danny Alexander playing to the media gallery and spinning their lies. Lets remember, Maude has form - over £30k in expenses for a flat a couple of hundred yards from one he already owned outright - yet you trust what he has to say?

Demands? The strikers aren't making any demands - we are NOT asking for anything new, simply defending what we already have. Pensions are NOT unfair or unsustainable, this is just divisive spin - check your facts.

BeardyBill wrote:
Please don't misrepresent me darkenergy...I'm not branding you a halfwit because you do not agree with me, but because you are incapable of exercising any judgement of your own, instead you trot out half- formed irrelevancies, which you then peddle as reality.

I'm not ignoring the hardship that will be suffered on Wednesday, merely pointing out that the responsibility for it lies squarely at the heart of Government.

What do I know of you? Only what I've gleaned from your posts...bitterness, a feeling of being hard done by, and a simplistic understanding of things, coloured entirely by what your lords and masters want you to think.

Perhaps when you learn to respect others points of view, you will earn some respect yourself.

abbotboy wrote:
Teachers, and I wonder if anybody else, will only loose half a days wage for the strike on the 30th, because of the rules of thier pay.
Can Beardy Bill confirm that all public pension funds are soley funded by pension holders and nobody else is financing the same pension pots...?

BeardyBill wrote:
Darkenergy,

You've proved my point....incapable of independent thought. Plagiarising quotes from others proves nothing apart from you know how to use google.

towney wrote:
Blind Fury
" Hey, we're gonna make you pay an extra £70 a month, on top of the 11% you already pay into your pension. Not only that, we're not going to let you leave your job after 30 years service, let's make that an extra 10 years for you, and you won't get any more for it....in fact you'll be getting less"

You are not special in this......the private sector have had to make the same changes. It's just that we do not make a huge song and dance about it and get on with it.

And as for your comment... "I doubt there are plenty of unemployed with enough brains to do public sector jobs, hence they are unemployed"....I find that a little harsh, in fact maybe it is you who does not have enough brains....as the last time I checked public sector workers were not only teachers (who do not always have brains) but also street cleaners and the like and they do not need a list of qualifications and would be replaced easily.

And before anyone takes the above the wrong way I think the street cleaners etc do a grand job, I was just proving a point to the muppet.