THE SAM MORSHEAD COLUMN: Why Daily Mail scribe got it wrong about Town and their Football League rivals (From Swindon Advertiser)
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THE SAM MORSHEAD COLUMN: Why Daily Mail scribe got it wrong about Town and their Football League rivals
6:00am Saturday 23rd February 2013 in STFC News By Sam Morshead
Adver chief sports writer Sam Morshead
TODAY, dear friends, a rant. A rant on behalf of the men and women who follow, run and write about clubs in the lower echelons of the Football League pyramid.
It was sparked on Wednesday morning by an article in the Daily Mail by Martin Samuel, a writer I have admired for as long as I can remember. But this week I feel he got it horribly wrong.
Samuel is a hugely respected and decorated journalist, a man who has written for three of the top national newspapers and whose job comes with a mandate for sparking debate and discussion.
In essence he has done exactly that, and his piece published by the Mail this week pulled up very real issues Paolo Di Canio is likely to face as he prepares to embark to whatever the next step of his managerial adventure might be.
However, while half Samuel’s article gave an insightful account into the dynamics of football management and the tricky equilibrium Di Canio needs to achieve between club politics and the passionate and explosive nature of his own extrovert character, the way in which he put his thoughts across reeked of hypocrisy and condescension.
If Di Canio’s resignation was indeed the “local news” as he described it, why did he deem it necessary to use 1,500 words in a publication whose circulation is a shade under 1.6million copies a day… across the country?
If Di Canio was “local news” which could be “quickly relegated to the margins”, why did Samuel’s paper decide on Friday that the story of the Italian’s late-night visit to his old office was worthy of the back page in some of its editions?
It was a contradictory and self-defeating exercise, but drawing on conversations I have had this week it was not the content but the tone of his musings which have swelled offence.
The whole piece seemed to address not only Swindon but lower-league football in general with a passing disdain usually reserved for flea-ridden sewer rats or Tory politicians.
He casually dismissed Swindon’s average attendance of a little under 8,500 as making the club “bigger than Doncaster Rovers, but not quite up there with MK Dons”. He made a mockery of Tranmere Rovers by using their identity as the anchor in a put-me-down when comparing Di Canio to Arsene Wenger. He had a chuckle about SN1 having about as much national significance as RH11 or TW8.
What Samuel didn’t realise is that, while we may live in the era of sat nav, there still remains a genuine interest shown by Football League clubs in each other’s practices.
The roubles and dollars being thrown like confetti around the Premier League may be entrancing, but the heart of football still resides at places like Prenton Park, Plainmoor, Vale Park and Home Park.
I’d urge Samuel to look through club’s forums – in Swindon’s case thetownend.com – to see the network of sides whose attendances are modest but whose history is just as credible as Saudi-infested Manchester City and the Liverpool Red Sox.
Look out for fans of club upon club discussing, in earnest, what an extraordinary job Ronnie Moore has done on a state pension-sized budget at Tranmere; read the genuine concern for the health of Torquay manager Martin Ling; discover the supporter-driven investigations of what went wrong under Perry Deakin at Port Vale and see how much support the Football League community offered Plymouth during their time of need.
This is authentic football drama, so often overlooked in favour of John Terry’s latest fling or Geoff Shreeves stating the bleeding obvious. Why does it have to be “local news”?
The answer is sales figures – and perhaps quite rightly so. Premier League sides draw Premier League audiences globally (10 per cent of the world support Manchester United if the club’s recent figures are to be believed). Newspapers have to cater for that. In doing so, however, we neglect the very fabric of what the sport was built upon - a communal love of the game.
Samuel can quite rightly claim that Frank Lampard’s contract is given more significance than the recent winding-up order issued against Notts County or Bristol Rovers’ ongoing attempts to secure permission to build a new ground, but that does not mean that the England midfielder’s future is more important than the financial state of the oldest club in the world or the financial development of another.
In this case significance is an editorial decision, not a tangible quality of the issue at hand.
So when Samuel chose to belittle the events of the past four weeks to four months at the County Ground he was, possibly inadvertently, diminishing the mass appeal of our football world.
He is right when he suggested that I will miss Di Canio – any journalist would. Perhaps there is a hint of jealousy in his voice as he recounts the rollercoaster ride we, as a club and as a paper, have endured and enjoyed these past 21 months.
But I’ll move on, as I’m sure each and every one of you will, until the time comes when we look back and realise this was just the news of the time – like promotion to the Premiership, re-election to the Football League, the financial scandal under Brian Hillier and the miracle of 1969. News, mind you, not “local news”.
Oh and one other thing while we’re at it, Martin, we’re the Swindon Advertiser.
Comments(67)
stevehalloz
says...
6:34am Sat 23 Feb 13
Not that I'm not keen to see us back in the Premier League, mind you!
redjet
says...
6:53am Sat 23 Feb 13
swindon69
says...
7:02am Sat 23 Feb 13
blogspot.co.uk/2013/
02/done-deal-at-swin
don-town.html?m=1.
RogerJ1969
says...
7:15am Sat 23 Feb 13
Occasionally I read a Samuals column and generally feel they are both poorly researched and unbalanced to swell the column inches.
When I read the artical on Wednesday I felt exactly as Sam has described. Problem is these people see only the money bloated Premier League and enjoy jollies on a weekly basis. The Football League is essential to the health of the national game and to rubbish it is not to understand the pyramid that under scores to top level.
ciclosporindorset
says...
7:24am Sat 23 Feb 13
castle9
says...
7:33am Sat 23 Feb 13
- my thoughts exactly, says it all really...
Rebel_phish
says...
7:50am Sat 23 Feb 13
swindon69 wrote:Nice reply. Pity they can't see beyond their own points of view.
The Daily Mail article was condescending in the extreme and dismissive of lower league football in this country. Without the dynamics of promotion and relegation, fuelling the ambitions of clubs up and down the country, the Premier League would be nothing. The most galling thing for me was that the newspaper wouldn't publish my retort, so please feel free to read it on my blog - http://stuartrivers.
blogspot.co.uk/2013/
02/done-deal-at-swin
don-town.html?m=1.
mancrobin
says...
7:53am Sat 23 Feb 13
By the way, just for the sake of journalistic accuracy, it is Labour politicians that get shown disdain by the Mail more often than Tory.
Since 1950
says...
7:58am Sat 23 Feb 13
Jeremy Hilary Boob
says...
8:03am Sat 23 Feb 13
FWIW no one outside of the Adver calls it that either. It comes across as an attempt to use the N5 abbreviation Arsenal fans use but every time I see it in print is just annoys me. Sorry Sam, I've no idea of your background but it actually comes across as someone from outside Swindon trying to show that they're down with the locals (a bit like the time Barrie Hudson called Victoria Road "Vicky Hill" - no one calls it that either so his attempt to be cool backfired on him) by latching onto the sort of expression used by fans of another club and transferring that to the Town. I wish you'd stop using it.
Rebel_phish
says...
8:05am Sat 23 Feb 13
The PL is at the pinicle of the football pyramid. Its believed by many lower clubs to be the promised land (PL). There are a few clubs, that since its inseption have never been relegated.
So what if the FL severed all connection with the PL. No relegation from or promotion to it.
I suppose, the twenty-two clubs in it would just get bigger. But without the so called lower league teams coming through from the ranks, there would be no spice, no pazazz, "little club" taking on the "big boys". Over time, the PL would become stagnant, smelly, borring. Over time it would wither and die.
No, it needs fresh clubs to enter into the afray. Fresh meat to the grinder? Maybe. But fresh blood all the same.
The PL needs the lower tiers and all that their clubs strive for. The lower leagues dont necessarily need the PL.
Wilesy
says...
8:06am Sat 23 Feb 13
TheDukeOfBanbury
says...
8:10am Sat 23 Feb 13
Well written indeed and you should send a copy of your article to him.
There is something unique about following a Lower league club. I respect people who travel the country spending lots of money doing this.
Then you get the armchair typical Man Utd fan living in Swindon for example who dares to has an opinion and even worse criticises how poor Swindon are as a Club!! I don't engage in any football conversations with these people and would even rather engage with an Oxford fan who actually follows his respective team.
As you say PDC is an interesting character who sells papers but they should comment more on what he has achieved in his short managerial career rather than slinging the dirt.
Oi Den!
says...
8:10am Sat 23 Feb 13
ghanimah
says...
8:22am Sat 23 Feb 13
redjet wrote:That's standard practice on the Mail website...on any subject, not just football. If you post anything that is contrary or points out errors or inaccuracies it won't get published.
Sam we must be spiritually connected. Your article is almost a carbon copy of the comment I posted on the Daily Mail site, unfortunatley they did not have the courage to show it and it was moderated out. There was no swearing ,no abuse, no racism just an opinion that was contrary to the article. Seems a bit un-democratic to me, I didn't realise the Daily Mail was run by FIFA. :)
dazinblack
says...
8:32am Sat 23 Feb 13
As Daily Mail readers would say "if only Diana was still alive....these shenanigans would never have happened.."
Great article Sam keep them coming, yes you may be biased towards Swindon but that's how we like it a local team for local people. I detest ploughing through the nationals on a Monday morning to find the match report only to see in twenty words they have misspelt the scorers name etc
dazinblack
says...
8:33am Sat 23 Feb 13
fatman
says...
8:40am Sat 23 Feb 13
Would you not have been better off just saying . like politicians in the chamber .
Stickshaker
says...
8:43am Sat 23 Feb 13
davel4848
says...
8:46am Sat 23 Feb 13
Some people seem to forget where they came from too easily.
Oh, by the way, Martin Samuel is a West Ham supporter.
super reds
says...
8:50am Sat 23 Feb 13
Regarding other stuff about the lower league teams, the old saying 'the rich get richer etc etc' springs to mind, I've often noticed on the sports programmes, there could be a weekend without Prem & Championship football but all the so called pundits want to talk about is the top sides & what they'll be doing in their next match, it's almost like leagues 1 & 2 don't exist or we're a piece of dogs**t stuck to their shoes, an inconvenience, if they were to give us more publicity (lower league teams), treat all the teams a little more equally, then maybe more people would give us more than just a passing glance, publicity, unfortunately will always be given to the 'big' clubs as, as Sam as alluded to, it will sell more papers than a untrue headline of 'Di Canio breaks into County Ground'
the don69
says...
9:01am Sat 23 Feb 13
SAPFanSTFC
says...
9:14am Sat 23 Feb 13
...just one point - as per Fatman: Let's point out...they're all as bad as one another.
...
I think you should advertise your article around all of the other non Premier League clubs and see what they think.
...
On top of their 'SELECTED' articles did they give ONE OUNCE of credit to the players for hitting top of the league on Wednesday!?...nope just another self serving piece of uninvestigated trip on Friday.
...
Not ONE word about the great job the players did!!!..come on guys let's FORCE the media world to sit up and take notice of the fighting spirit that exists in STFC!!
STFCman&boy1973
says...
9:17am Sat 23 Feb 13
I love SN1, and lots of other fans know it as that as well...
COYMRs
PS is Paolo coming to the game today? Is he coming back to Finnish the job?
capott
says...
9:22am Sat 23 Feb 13
Jeremy Hilary Boob wrote:Sorry Jeremy but Vick Hill still exists! I've always known/called it by that name - 61 years! Also doesn't SN1 signify that the County Ground is a town centre stadium as opposed to perhaps some out of town, hard to get to, park!
I thought he was right about the SN1 thing though - no one outside of Swindon knows where it is and certainly no one calls the club/the ground that
FWIW no one outside of the Adver calls it that either. It comes across as an attempt to use the N5 abbreviation Arsenal fans use but every time I see it in print is just annoys me. Sorry Sam, I've no idea of your background but it actually comes across as someone from outside Swindon trying to show that they're down with the locals (a bit like the time Barrie Hudson called Victoria Road "Vicky Hill" - no one calls it that either so his attempt to be cool backfired on him) by latching onto the sort of expression used by fans of another club and transferring that to the Town. I wish you'd stop using it.
Jeremy Hilary Boob
says...
9:28am Sat 23 Feb 13
capott wrote:"Vicky Hill" really? I've lived here for 43 years and I've only ever heard it called "VIC Hill" (my dad's lived here for 70 and he's only ever called it that).
Jeremy Hilary Boob wrote:Sorry Jeremy but Vick Hill still exists! I've always known/called it by that name - 61 years! Also doesn't SN1 signify that the County Ground is a town centre stadium as opposed to perhaps some out of town, hard to get to, park!
I thought he was right about the SN1 thing though - no one outside of Swindon knows where it is and certainly no one calls the club/the ground that
FWIW no one outside of the Adver calls it that either. It comes across as an attempt to use the N5 abbreviation Arsenal fans use but every time I see it in print is just annoys me. Sorry Sam, I've no idea of your background but it actually comes across as someone from outside Swindon trying to show that they're down with the locals (a bit like the time Barrie Hudson called Victoria Road "Vicky Hill" - no one calls it that either so his attempt to be cool backfired on him) by latching onto the sort of expression used by fans of another club and transferring that to the Town. I wish you'd stop using it.
If the club was based in SN30 the Adver would still have latched onto it - an SN30 could easily be close to the town (SN25 is closer than everything above SN5, it was just allocated later).
The point is, I've never heard anyone actually use it. It might be a handy online/txt spk shortcut but I cringe every time I see it used in print.
KojaktheWarg
says...
9:30am Sat 23 Feb 13
Sorry but the daily mail is a pathetic rag.
To me, its a paper to comfort the dwindling lower middle class as they sit at home and despair against the state of the nation - instead of doing something about it.
townendoldie
says...
9:35am Sat 23 Feb 13
http://www.telegraph
.co.uk/sport/footbal
l/teams/bradford-cit
y/9888730/League-Cup
-final-2013-Bradford
-a-city-united-by-tr
agedy-and-triumph-ta
king-their-rollercoa
ster-ride-to-Wembley
.html
red white
says...
9:36am Sat 23 Feb 13
I thought maybe it was a slow news week,but it was hardly that.
Obviously his bosses trying to get their writers to wind people up as usual.
Oh and they had a picture of Paolo too.
Someone send Samuels Sam's piece and let him know what horse apples he writes.Mind you that is what he probably wants some sort of reaction,the loser.
We are Swindon,we're top of the league!
supersaver
says...
9:48am Sat 23 Feb 13
Park North Red
says...
9:56am Sat 23 Feb 13
bushwacker
says...
10:04am Sat 23 Feb 13
rockdog
says...
10:11am Sat 23 Feb 13
Highworth red
says...
10:13am Sat 23 Feb 13
flynners1962
says...
10:31am Sat 23 Feb 13
flynners1962
says...
10:31am Sat 23 Feb 13
midland red
says...
10:33am Sat 23 Feb 13
Football supporting is in the heart and has been said before..one can change your car, your house, your wife (or husband!) but one can't change your team no matter what!!
I can admire the football that is on offer in the premier league but I will never experience the feeling I get when supporting the town.
Pewsham Red
says...
10:33am Sat 23 Feb 13
Anyone with any sense has always considered the Daily Mail a complete rag of a paper, with two bit hack journalism that sensationalises everything to increase it's readership amongst the uneducated classes.
I completely agree with your piece and it just emphasises what a poor journalist this Samuel bloke is and what his paper is all about.
mickry
says...
10:55am Sat 23 Feb 13
Whoever invented the Daily Mail
Ought to be cut down to size
For taking a beautiful tree of the forest
To cover it over with lies
Mick
red white
says...
11:04am Sat 23 Feb 13
bushwacker wrote:OK,you mean 9AM though,IMO.
I want to initiate a reduction in the OTT use of acronyms across the UK and the SA. After recently returning to the UK from a top-level meeting with the CEO of BP on a BA flight from the UAE, I have outlined plans to introduce a ban on most abbreviations ASAP. I want my intentions known at 9 o'clock (GMT) Wednesday am at a Q&A session on HMS Belfast with members of the SA from SN1 during which you can answer some FAQ's.
STFC,1st in LGE 1.
adystfc
says...
11:06am Sat 23 Feb 13
We are PANTS
says...
11:18am Sat 23 Feb 13
Jeremy Hilary Boob wrote:I like the term SN1............... Why is it such a bad thing???
I thought he was right about the SN1 thing though - no one outside of Swindon knows where it is and certainly no one calls the club/the ground that
FWIW no one outside of the Adver calls it that either. It comes across as an attempt to use the N5 abbreviation Arsenal fans use but every time I see it in print is just annoys me. Sorry Sam, I've no idea of your background but it actually comes across as someone from outside Swindon trying to show that they're down with the locals (a bit like the time Barrie Hudson called Victoria Road "Vicky Hill" - no one calls it that either so his attempt to be cool backfired on him) by latching onto the sort of expression used by fans of another club and transferring that to the Town. I wish you'd stop using it.
batch
says...
11:19am Sat 23 Feb 13
See the trend and be afraid.
liden623
says...
11:26am Sat 23 Feb 13
"the way in which he put his thoughts across reeked of hypocrisy and condescension."
He may be a good journalist but is totally arrogant and only his opinion is the right one. This article is typical of him. He has written several articles slamming PDC. When we won the league by a mile last season I wrote to him suggesting he retract his bigoted views. As could be expected it was beneath him to reply to someone with the audacity to disagree with this supreme being.
It is also annoying that outside the premiership there are no football clubs worth allocating space to in any of the "top" papers.
Wonder Strike
says...
11:36am Sat 23 Feb 13
adystfc
says...
11:43am Sat 23 Feb 13
red white
says...
11:47am Sat 23 Feb 13
adystfc wrote:Hate to say this,but they do and it is a very popular site,that's all i'll give them.
I've stopped buying the Daily Mail due to its very poor coverage of NPower League Football.. Everyone has that choice so it's up to them whether they carry on buying that particular paper. FWIW I don't live in Swindon so the Swindon Advertiser's Thisisstfc site is one of my first reference points for STFC news.. Do the Mail even have an online presence!?
In fact you can read Samuel's nonsense on it if you dare.
Jeremy Hilary Boob
says...
11:52am Sat 23 Feb 13
adystfc wrote:Sadly the Mail is the biggest website in the country outside of the BBC.
I've stopped buying the Daily Mail due to its very poor coverage of NPower League Football.. Everyone has that choice so it's up to them whether they carry on buying that particular paper. FWIW I don't live in Swindon so the Swindon Advertiser's Thisisstfc site is one of my first reference points for STFC news.. Do the Mail even have an online presence!?
Admittedly this is down to hundreds of stories about scantily clad female "celebs" than actual news.
eastmidsred
says...
11:59am Sat 23 Feb 13
Football has become totally lopsided financially and at least half of lower league clubs must be close to going under. However, this is still the bedrock of football.
The money and in particular the wages in the Premiership are scandalous and lots of the 'ne'er do well players' are killing us - aided and abetted by Sky Sports etc. The financial impact on the lower leagues and the escalation of costs means that a lot of people can't afford to turn up to support their local team and can't afford to take their kids. It's a ticking timebomb.
Jeremy Hilary Boob
says...
12:02pm Sat 23 Feb 13
Wonder Strike wrote:Outside of their own town's and maybe the London ones I doubt it. Could most people identify on here identify, say, TS, WF or DY without looking them up?
Great article Sam. I don't know why people moan about the SN1 thing. It's the post code and shows we are the centre of the town. Surely people understand post codes and would recognise other towns and cities codes?
As a shortcode for "Swindon Town", "the County Ground" or "the club" or anything along those lines, SN1 looks a bit daft in a newspaper. Does the Evening Standard use N5 for Arsenal that their fans use as an online abbreviation?
It might be the postcode that ground is in but the whole town centre and beyond is SN1. It's not as if we're the LA Dodgers and have our own postcode. We haven't even got the last three digits as solely representing the club (which you can get if the Royal Mail thinkgs you're important enough).
Online it's fine for these sorts of forums but it's not as though the Adver is so limited for space that it can't fit something longer into its articles.
SAPFanSTFC
says...
12:03pm Sat 23 Feb 13
batch wrote:Oh Sh1t.....so does Father Christmas!!
Martin Samuel has a beard. Hans Gruber in Die Hard had a beard.Ming the Merciless had a beard.
See the trend and be afraid.
...is he a sleeper!?
:-)
SAPFanSTFC
says...
12:18pm Sat 23 Feb 13
bushwacker wrote:Better move PDQ have you invited the FL or FIFA?...if so what is their ETA?..If not better do so ASAP or TSMHTF.
I want to initiate a reduction in the OTT use of acronyms across the UK and the SA. After recently returning to the UK from a top-level meeting with the CEO of BP on a BA flight from the UAE, I have outlined plans to introduce a ban on most abbreviations ASAP. I want my intentions known at 9 o'clock (GMT) Wednesday am at a Q&A session on HMS Belfast with members of the SA from SN1 during which you can answer some FAQ's.
...
It's all FSB anyway!
billbst
says...
12:20pm Sat 23 Feb 13
burford-red
says...
12:31pm Sat 23 Feb 13
10% of the worlds population has never even been within 10 miles of the theatre of wet dreams but claim to be the greatest fans in the world. get a grip samuel we all live in the real world.
Steve. Brentford
says...
12:47pm Sat 23 Feb 13
We are PANTS wrote:I detest the term SN1 it makes me cringe every time our club/ground is referred to as a postcode. i grew up in Pinehurst going to football with mates (some that you know Pants) loving STFC and the County Ground never did i hear it called SN1 it is only recent years that this postcode lark has appeared,Everyone's different i guess but why refer to your ground as a postcode rather than what it is,that's what i don't get.
Jeremy Hilary Boob wrote:I like the term SN1............... Why is it such a bad thing???
I thought he was right about the SN1 thing though - no one outside of Swindon knows where it is and certainly no one calls the club/the ground that
FWIW no one outside of the Adver calls it that either. It comes across as an attempt to use the N5 abbreviation Arsenal fans use but every time I see it in print is just annoys me. Sorry Sam, I've no idea of your background but it actually comes across as someone from outside Swindon trying to show that they're down with the locals (a bit like the time Barrie Hudson called Victoria Road "Vicky Hill" - no one calls it that either so his attempt to be cool backfired on him) by latching onto the sort of expression used by fans of another club and transferring that to the Town. I wish you'd stop using it.
Oi Den!
says...
12:55pm Sat 23 Feb 13
Steve. Brentford wrote:Same here Steve. Not the sort of stuff us Pinehurst boys feel comfortable with.
We are PANTS wrote:I detest the term SN1 it makes me cringe every time our club/ground is referred to as a postcode. i grew up in Pinehurst going to football with mates (some that you know Pants) loving STFC and the County Ground never did i hear it called SN1 it is only recent years that this postcode lark has appeared,Everyone's different i guess but why refer to your ground as a postcode rather than what it is,that's what i don't get.
Jeremy Hilary Boob wrote:I like the term SN1............... Why is it such a bad thing???
I thought he was right about the SN1 thing though - no one outside of Swindon knows where it is and certainly no one calls the club/the ground that
FWIW no one outside of the Adver calls it that either. It comes across as an attempt to use the N5 abbreviation Arsenal fans use but every time I see it in print is just annoys me. Sorry Sam, I've no idea of your background but it actually comes across as someone from outside Swindon trying to show that they're down with the locals (a bit like the time Barrie Hudson called Victoria Road "Vicky Hill" - no one calls it that either so his attempt to be cool backfired on him) by latching onto the sort of expression used by fans of another club and transferring that to the Town. I wish you'd stop using it.
batch
says...
1:04pm Sat 23 Feb 13
SAPFanSTFC wrote:Gray beards lose their evil powers. Dumbledore, Gandalph, saruman died his.
batch wrote:Oh Sh1t.....so does Father Christmas!!
Martin Samuel has a beard. Hans Gruber in Die Hard had a beard.Ming the Merciless had a beard.
See the trend and be afraid.
...is he a sleeper!?
:-)
batch
says...
1:04pm Sat 23 Feb 13
maldavies
says...
1:13pm Sat 23 Feb 13
_sa. I'm sure the quality of your journalism has been noted by the Nationals. Keep true to the spirit if your article when you're writing for a national audience..which can't be far away.
LondonRobin
says...
1:26pm Sat 23 Feb 13
leader1111
says...
6:22pm Sat 23 Feb 13
BournemouthRobin
says...
7:11pm Sat 23 Feb 13
batch wrote:One of the funniest things I've read in ages!!!
Martin Samuel has a beard. Hans Gruber in Die Hard had a beard.Ming the Merciless had a beard.
See the trend and be afraid.
newtonred
says...
8:25pm Sat 23 Feb 13
SimonPrice351
says...
10:08pm Sat 23 Feb 13
However, I doubt Martin Samuel will be losing any sleep over his comments.
Jeremy Hilary Boob
says...
11:37pm Sat 23 Feb 13
SimonPrice351 wrote:Not on his £400k salary, no.
The political comments aside, very well said Sam. I guess you are a leftie?
However, I doubt Martin Samuel will be losing any sleep over his comments.
Anoldgreymoonraker
says...
3:44am Sun 24 Feb 13
creeping up,get used to it

U REDS says...
6:24am Sat 23 Feb 13