Campaigners ready to fight library cuts in Swindon

Swindon Advertiser: Shirely Burnham, of Save Old Town Library Buy this photo » Shirely Burnham, of Save Old Town Library

A CAMPAIGN has started against Swindon Council’s plans to slash the opening hours of libraries to help save about £15m to balance the budget in 2013/14.

The Conservative administration final budget proposals lay out plans to cut the staffed opening hours across all libraries by 26 per cent – or 132 hours per week – to save about £99,000 in staff costs.

A total of 6.9 full-time equivalent posts would be affected, although there are currently 3.7 full-time equivalent vacancies.

The plan is to provide just 10 hours a week in smaller libraries, 30 hours in medium libraries, 45 hours in larger libraries and 55 at Central Library.

In most cases, the reduced staffing hours will reduce the actual opening hours, but Old Town, which is embedded in the Arts Centre, in Devizes Road, will see no change in actual opening hours as the council says it can operate for periods without staff.

The smaller libraries are Covingham, Penhill, Pinetrees, Liden, Old Town, Even Swindon, and Walcot; the medium libraries are Moredon and Rodbourne Cheney, Upper Stratton, Park and Wroughton; and the larger libraries are: Highworth, West Swindon and North Swindon.

Shirley Burnham, of the action group Save Old Town Library, said the group would launch protests and a petition because the move could lead to libraries closing, adding that savings should be found instead in senior management.

She said: “It’s not good news for us in Old Town to be cut from 18 staffed hours to 10 per week – nearly 50 per cent. You will remember we fought as hard in the past to keep our frontline staff as we did for our library itself.

“At least the door to the Arts Centre is open much of the time, so people can use a checkout machine, if it’s working, to get books – but staff do not only check out books. They are essential sources of information, help with computers – and, basically, ensure a well-run, quality library.

“Another case in point is Penhill Library – its hours are to be cut from 19 to 10 – but the doors will be shut and people locked out the rest of the time. People who depend on the smaller libraries are penalised in a postcode lottery and will be in receipt of the dregs of a two-tier service.”

Coun Stan Pajak (Lib Dem, Eastcott) said: “When you cut staff to a certain stage, people start to worry about the viability of the libraries. And I wonder, with 10 staffing hours, are we reaching that in some of our smaller libraries.”

Coun Keith Williams, cabinet member for leisure and strategic transport, said it was not the best use of money to fund longer hours in libraries with lower borrowing rates, adding that Covingham, Liden and Pinetrees had their hours increased in 2011.

He said: “We do get relatively low borrowing rates per hour in these little libraries and hopefully by concentrating the hours to core hours when people do need to use it most, hopefully we can get some of these borrowing rates up.”

Full council will set the budget on February 21.

Comments (70)

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12:15pm Sat 9 Feb 13

Phantom Poster says...

Does anyone use libraries anymore? If they do, why isn't access 10 hours a week sufficient, especially if it saves £99K?
Does anyone use libraries anymore? If they do, why isn't access 10 hours a week sufficient, especially if it saves £99K? Phantom Poster

12:23pm Sat 9 Feb 13

peatmoor pirate says...

I use libraries but this approach seems reasonable. The whingers from Old Town Library are a class apart though; it's a short walk or bus ride to the main town library and the machines work just fine everywhere else.
I use libraries but this approach seems reasonable. The whingers from Old Town Library are a class apart though; it's a short walk or bus ride to the main town library and the machines work just fine everywhere else. peatmoor pirate

1:23pm Sat 9 Feb 13

Tim Newroman says...

Phantom Poster wrote:
Does anyone use libraries anymore? If they do, why isn't access 10 hours a week sufficient, especially if it saves £99K?
Agreed. Anyone seriously interested in using a library doesn't really need it to be open any more than about 3 hours per day, twice a week.
[quote][p][bold]Phantom Poster[/bold] wrote: Does anyone use libraries anymore? If they do, why isn't access 10 hours a week sufficient, especially if it saves £99K?[/p][/quote]Agreed. Anyone seriously interested in using a library doesn't really need it to be open any more than about 3 hours per day, twice a week. Tim Newroman

2:56pm Sat 9 Feb 13

stu2010 says...

Bite the bullet and buy a kindle, in the long term it will work out cheaper than paying for bus fares to and from the library and it will help save the enviroment, less trees cut down and less half empty buses spewing out black smoke
Bite the bullet and buy a kindle, in the long term it will work out cheaper than paying for bus fares to and from the library and it will help save the enviroment, less trees cut down and less half empty buses spewing out black smoke stu2010

5:02pm Sat 9 Feb 13

itsamess3 says...

We do seem to have many libraries-not surprising as swindon has spread in all directions.
3 hours for some libraries could deprive quite a few of the chance to use them as they could be at work etc.
We should all be asking why our council
has farmed out just about service at treble the cost. A good example being the bailiffs retaining over 50% of monies collected-despite having the ability to recover business and c/t very easily via the courts.
Does our council employ officers who can actually run a dept and know how to budget it? Seems not as the elected councillors obviously sanction hoards of advice from private companies with huge bills and endless feasibility studies which eats up the finance.
We do seem to have many libraries-not surprising as swindon has spread in all directions. 3 hours for some libraries could deprive quite a few of the chance to use them as they could be at work etc. We should all be asking why our council has farmed out just about service at treble the cost. A good example being the bailiffs retaining over 50% of monies collected-despite having the ability to recover business and c/t very easily via the courts. Does our council employ officers who can actually run a dept and know how to budget it? Seems not as the elected councillors obviously sanction hoards of advice from private companies with huge bills and endless feasibility studies which eats up the finance. itsamess3

6:08pm Sat 9 Feb 13

Tim Newroman says...

itsamess3 wrote...
3 hours for some libraries could deprive quite a few of the chance to use them as they could be at work etc.

Yes, that's correct. It would almost certainly mean that some people would not be able to conveniently attend whenever they wish.

Of course, to avoid that for everyone, all libraries would need to be open 24 hours a day.

Do think about what you post as to what you're actually saying.
[quote][b]itsamess3[/b] wrote...[p] 3 hours for some libraries could deprive quite a few of the chance to use them as they could be at work etc. [/p] Yes, that's correct. It would almost certainly mean that some people would not be able to conveniently attend whenever they wish. [p] Of course, to avoid that for everyone, all libraries would need to be open 24 hours a day. [p] Do think about what you post as to what you're actually saying. Tim Newroman

7:08pm Sat 9 Feb 13

itsamess3 says...

Tim Newroman wrote:
itsamess3 wrote...
3 hours for some libraries could deprive quite a few of the chance to use them as they could be at work etc.

Yes, that's correct. It would almost certainly mean that some people would not be able to conveniently attend whenever they wish.

Of course, to avoid that for everyone, all libraries would need to be open 24 hours a day.

Do think about what you post as to what you're actually saying.Oh dear--your thought process does not work well. Too simple for you is it?
Hence- a lesson in life is needed.
School kids for example-when is a convenient time to visit their local library? If the opening time was in school hours they could not use the library.
Housewives could. So could night shift workers provided they do not go straight to bed after their shift after all a day worker does not go to bed after their shift.
This does suggest 3-6pm or 4-7pm would benefit a wider group and the larger branches with more hours can cover the wider range.
Being a potential councillor i would have thought you could understand how simple this is to resolve.
[quote][p][bold]Tim Newroman[/bold] wrote: [quote][b]itsamess3[/b] wrote...[p] 3 hours for some libraries could deprive quite a few of the chance to use them as they could be at work etc. [/p] Yes, that's correct. It would almost certainly mean that some people would not be able to conveniently attend whenever they wish. [p] Of course, to avoid that for everyone, all libraries would need to be open 24 hours a day. [p] Do think about what you post as to what you're actually saying.[/p][/quote]Oh dear--your thought process does not work well. Too simple for you is it? Hence- a lesson in life is needed. School kids for example-when is a convenient time to visit their local library? If the opening time was in school hours they could not use the library. Housewives could. So could night shift workers provided they do not go straight to bed after their shift after all a day worker does not go to bed after their shift. This does suggest 3-6pm or 4-7pm would benefit a wider group and the larger branches with more hours can cover the wider range. Being a potential councillor i would have thought you could understand how simple this is to resolve. itsamess3

8:16pm Sat 9 Feb 13

Davey Gravey says...

Leave the libraries alone. Tories want to wipe out everything. Disgusting!! !!
Leave the libraries alone. Tories want to wipe out everything. Disgusting!! !! Davey Gravey

11:47pm Sat 9 Feb 13

Phantom Poster says...

itsamess3 wrote:
Tim Newroman wrote:
itsamess3 wrote...
3 hours for some libraries could deprive quite a few of the chance to use them as they could be at work etc.

Yes, that's correct. It would almost certainly mean that some people would not be able to conveniently attend whenever they wish.

Of course, to avoid that for everyone, all libraries would need to be open 24 hours a day.

Do think about what you post as to what you're actually saying.Oh dear--your thought process does not work well. Too simple for you is it?
Hence- a lesson in life is needed.
School kids for example-when is a convenient time to visit their local library? If the opening time was in school hours they could not use the library.
Housewives could. So could night shift workers provided they do not go straight to bed after their shift after all a day worker does not go to bed after their shift.
This does suggest 3-6pm or 4-7pm would benefit a wider group and the larger branches with more hours can cover the wider range.
Being a potential councillor i would have thought you could understand how simple this is to resolve.Tut, tut itsamess (is that 1,2 or3? you seem to have been banned a number of times!)

Books are really not that difficult to find! Go to a charity shop and find some really cheap! No need for expensive council run libraries!
[quote][p][bold]itsamess3[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Tim Newroman[/bold] wrote: [quote][b]itsamess3[/b] wrote...[p] 3 hours for some libraries could deprive quite a few of the chance to use them as they could be at work etc. [/p] Yes, that's correct. It would almost certainly mean that some people would not be able to conveniently attend whenever they wish. [p] Of course, to avoid that for everyone, all libraries would need to be open 24 hours a day. [p] Do think about what you post as to what you're actually saying.[/p][/quote]Oh dear--your thought process does not work well. Too simple for you is it? Hence- a lesson in life is needed. School kids for example-when is a convenient time to visit their local library? If the opening time was in school hours they could not use the library. Housewives could. So could night shift workers provided they do not go straight to bed after their shift after all a day worker does not go to bed after their shift. This does suggest 3-6pm or 4-7pm would benefit a wider group and the larger branches with more hours can cover the wider range. Being a potential councillor i would have thought you could understand how simple this is to resolve.[/p][/quote]Tut, tut itsamess (is that 1,2 or3? you seem to have been banned a number of times!) Books are really not that difficult to find! Go to a charity shop and find some really cheap! No need for expensive council run libraries! Phantom Poster

12:36am Sun 10 Feb 13

itsamess3 says...

Phantom
Yes we all know that you like to have your little digs at the same time as showing your lack of intelligence.
Do note i have always used itsamess and simply added 2 and 3 for my archive system-no bans or itsamess could not be used-i simply re-set my log-in and password and the adver system recognises my details.


"Books are really not that difficult to find! Go to a charity shop and find some really cheap! No need for expensive council run libraries!”

Clearly you do not know what services a library provides from your comment.

Libraries hold books generally not available for study purposes or learning-vital for students who could not afford the high price of specialist subjects needed to learn and gain success in their exams-perhaps if you had used libraries you would not have ended up making semi-conductors for a living as you claimed.
I do agree charity and secondhand bookshops can be a good source of reading books--but libraries generally have most books available to loan.
However reference libraries do not loan the specialist works.
Hope you find this helpful.
Phantom Yes we all know that you like to have your little digs at the same time as showing your lack of intelligence. Do note i have always used itsamess and simply added 2 and 3 for my archive system-no bans or itsamess could not be used-i simply re-set my log-in and password and the adver system recognises my details. "Books are really not that difficult to find! Go to a charity shop and find some really cheap! No need for expensive council run libraries!” Clearly you do not know what services a library provides from your comment. Libraries hold books generally not available for study purposes or learning-vital for students who could not afford the high price of specialist subjects needed to learn and gain success in their exams-perhaps if you had used libraries you would not have ended up making semi-conductors for a living as you claimed. I do agree charity and secondhand bookshops can be a good source of reading books--but libraries generally have most books available to loan. However reference libraries do not loan the specialist works. Hope you find this helpful. itsamess3

9:26am Sun 10 Feb 13

dglaholm says...

stu2010 wrote:
Bite the bullet and buy a kindle, in the long term it will work out cheaper than paying for bus fares to and from the library and it will help save the enviroment, less trees cut down and less half empty buses spewing out black smoke
A Kindle cant access the Councils free e-book library.
[quote][p][bold]stu2010[/bold] wrote: Bite the bullet and buy a kindle, in the long term it will work out cheaper than paying for bus fares to and from the library and it will help save the enviroment, less trees cut down and less half empty buses spewing out black smoke[/p][/quote]A Kindle cant access the Councils free e-book library. dglaholm

9:29am Sun 10 Feb 13

dglaholm says...

How long will it be before the ''Save our Li9brary'' petitions will be circulating by the Labour Party.
Lets see what they suggest to save money at the Councils budgest meeting.
Better use of Mobile libraries is the way forward giving more people access to books.
Also Walcot Library is a beacon of success that uses volunteers...
How long will it be before the ''Save our Li9brary'' petitions will be circulating by the Labour Party. Lets see what they suggest to save money at the Councils budgest meeting. Better use of Mobile libraries is the way forward giving more people access to books. Also Walcot Library is a beacon of success that uses volunteers... dglaholm

9:54am Sun 10 Feb 13

semitonic says...

Messy:
Do note i have always used itsamess and simply added 2 and 3 for my archive system-no bans or itsamess could not be used-i simply re-set my log-in and password and the adver system recognises my details.


What a load of cobblers, "archive system". Messy you don't have a clue how these things work do you - and you can't 'reset your log-in' - you got banned and started a new log-in, three times.

have you still got your Gordon Chalmers login? Go on messy, dig it out and give us all a laugh.
Messy: [quote]Do note i have always used itsamess and simply added 2 and 3 for my archive system-no bans or itsamess could not be used-i simply re-set my log-in and password and the adver system recognises my details.[/quote] What a load of cobblers, "archive system". Messy you don't have a clue how these things work do you - and you can't 'reset your log-in' - you got banned and started a new log-in, three times. have you still got your Gordon Chalmers login? Go on messy, dig it out and give us all a laugh. semitonic

10:56am Sun 10 Feb 13

purplerose says...

I think this is just a laugh why are you all complaining use the library or don,t use it simply but i can say that after living in highworth no body ever used that library and now in Wroughton no body use,s that either so why should the council pay to keep something open that might be used from time to time
I think this is just a laugh why are you all complaining use the library or don,t use it simply but i can say that after living in highworth no body ever used that library and now in Wroughton no body use,s that either so why should the council pay to keep something open that might be used from time to time purplerose

11:07am Sun 10 Feb 13

itsamess3 says...

Still not capable of discussing the articles i see. Guess you must have been banned quite a few times along with dozens of others with long lists of logins according to your claim.
Perhaps you should use the libraries more-many good reference books there on archiving and computer skills.
Unfortunately Gordon suffered a severe stroke some while back and remains very unwell.
Do try to post on the stories as you will not achieve anything by posting nonsense-i have achieved my aims.
Still not capable of discussing the articles i see. Guess you must have been banned quite a few times along with dozens of others with long lists of logins according to your claim. Perhaps you should use the libraries more-many good reference books there on archiving and computer skills. Unfortunately Gordon suffered a severe stroke some while back and remains very unwell. Do try to post on the stories as you will not achieve anything by posting nonsense-i have achieved my aims. itsamess3

11:12am Sun 10 Feb 13

Phantom Poster says...

itsamess3 wrote:
Phantom
Yes we all know that you like to have your little digs at the same time as showing your lack of intelligence.
Do note i have always used itsamess and simply added 2 and 3 for my archive system-no bans or itsamess could not be used-i simply re-set my log-in and password and the adver system recognises my details.


"Books are really not that difficult to find! Go to a charity shop and find some really cheap! No need for expensive council run libraries!”

Clearly you do not know what services a library provides from your comment.

Libraries hold books generally not available for study purposes or learning-vital for students who could not afford the high price of specialist subjects needed to learn and gain success in their exams-perhaps if you had used libraries you would not have ended up making semi-conductors for a living as you claimed.
I do agree charity and secondhand bookshops can be a good source of reading books--but libraries generally have most books available to loan.
However reference libraries do not loan the specialist works.
Hope you find this helpful.
You do realise that only the last paragraph in that post was attribual to me, don't you?

Let's cut the crap - you don't have an archive system. Your lack of IT related knowledge is quite obvious from your posts here (some people might find that strange for a world renowned nuclear scientist!). But what the hell - please explain to us all how your archive system works - I'd be fascinated!

Have you ever been to a local library? I have and there was a total lack of any type of specialist books.

I make semi-conductors for a living, do I? We are on the internet - you do realise what the word "claimed" means, don't you? What have you "claimed" and how believable is it?
[quote][p][bold]itsamess3[/bold] wrote: Phantom Yes we all know that you like to have your little digs at the same time as showing your lack of intelligence. Do note i have always used itsamess and simply added 2 and 3 for my archive system-no bans or itsamess could not be used-i simply re-set my log-in and password and the adver system recognises my details. "Books are really not that difficult to find! Go to a charity shop and find some really cheap! No need for expensive council run libraries!” Clearly you do not know what services a library provides from your comment. Libraries hold books generally not available for study purposes or learning-vital for students who could not afford the high price of specialist subjects needed to learn and gain success in their exams-perhaps if you had used libraries you would not have ended up making semi-conductors for a living as you claimed. I do agree charity and secondhand bookshops can be a good source of reading books--but libraries generally have most books available to loan. However reference libraries do not loan the specialist works. Hope you find this helpful.[/p][/quote]You do realise that only the last paragraph in that post was attribual to me, don't you? Let's cut the crap - you don't have an archive system. Your lack of IT related knowledge is quite obvious from your posts here (some people might find that strange for a world renowned nuclear scientist!). But what the hell - please explain to us all how your archive system works - I'd be fascinated! Have you ever been to a local library? I have and there was a total lack of any type of specialist books. I make semi-conductors for a living, do I? We are on the internet - you do realise what the word "claimed" means, don't you? What have you "claimed" and how believable is it? Phantom Poster

11:18am Sun 10 Feb 13

semitonic says...

No more Gordon then, too difficult running more than one login simultaneously I suppose, as both you and Robbo found out. At least you're now sensible enough to stick with one, even if it does change regularly.

And yes the local libraries probably do have many good books on computer skills, I don't need them but I rather think you do.
No more Gordon then, too difficult running more than one login simultaneously I suppose, as both you and Robbo found out. At least you're now sensible enough to stick with one, even if it does change regularly. And yes the local libraries probably do have many good books on computer skills, I don't need them but I rather think you do. semitonic

11:19am Sun 10 Feb 13

semitonic says...

(last post @messy)
(last post @messy) semitonic

11:32am Sun 10 Feb 13

Peter Mallinson says...

Walcot Library would have celebrated it's 4th anniverary in April 2013 of being run by volunteers.

It is much more than just a room full of books as some may imagine, it is the starting place for young children of pre-school age to aquire basic learning skills.

It is also where people who for whatever reason cannot afford a computer or internet access this is free of charge in the library.

Calling this service "the dregs of a two-tier service” is disgraceful and humiliating for the volunteers who give 5 days of their free time per week to keep it going.

The definition of DREGS is "The most worthless part or parts of something". Have a look in a dictionary.
Walcot Library would have celebrated it's 4th anniverary in April 2013 of being run by volunteers. It is much more than just a room full of books as some may imagine, it is the starting place for young children of pre-school age to aquire basic learning skills. It is also where people who for whatever reason cannot afford a computer or internet access this is free of charge in the library. Calling this service "the dregs of a two-tier service” is disgraceful and humiliating for the volunteers who give 5 days of their free time per week to keep it going. The definition of DREGS is "The most worthless part or parts of something". Have a look in a dictionary. Peter Mallinson

12:08pm Sun 10 Feb 13

itsamess3 says...

Peter
The value of libraries and experienced librarians cannot be denied. I spent endless hours over many years in our reference library and uni libraries as buying books was a drain on my finances. I always found the staff helpul and knowledgable in our libraries.
You are right-the learning through libraries can begin at an early age and in this computer age swindon has taken that on board.
The council should be strengthening the libraries rather than destroying them.
Peter The value of libraries and experienced librarians cannot be denied. I spent endless hours over many years in our reference library and uni libraries as buying books was a drain on my finances. I always found the staff helpul and knowledgable in our libraries. You are right-the learning through libraries can begin at an early age and in this computer age swindon has taken that on board. The council should be strengthening the libraries rather than destroying them. itsamess3

12:46pm Sun 10 Feb 13

itsamess3 says...

Phantom + semi
How you can claim to know what computer skills others have from a social site is beyond belief and archiving is essential in many occupations and very simple to set up.
Far better to have the original information than assumptions.
Perhaps you should both pop down to one of the libraries as i am sure there will be a young child to help you build an archive and the tools to flag up any item. Hurrah for our libraries.
Phantom + semi How you can claim to know what computer skills others have from a social site is beyond belief and archiving is essential in many occupations and very simple to set up. Far better to have the original information than assumptions. Perhaps you should both pop down to one of the libraries as i am sure there will be a young child to help you build an archive and the tools to flag up any item. Hurrah for our libraries. itsamess3

1:14pm Sun 10 Feb 13

Tim Newroman says...

itsamess3 wrote:
Still not capable of discussing the articles i see. Guess you must have been banned quite a few times along with dozens of others with long lists of logins according to your claim.
Perhaps you should use the libraries more-many good reference books there on archiving and computer skills.
Unfortunately Gordon suffered a severe stroke some while back and remains very unwell.
Do try to post on the stories as you will not achieve anything by posting nonsense-i have achieved my aims.
Poor old Gordon, do send him our good wishes as to his speedy recovery.
[quote][p][bold]itsamess3[/bold] wrote: Still not capable of discussing the articles i see. Guess you must have been banned quite a few times along with dozens of others with long lists of logins according to your claim. Perhaps you should use the libraries more-many good reference books there on archiving and computer skills. Unfortunately Gordon suffered a severe stroke some while back and remains very unwell. Do try to post on the stories as you will not achieve anything by posting nonsense-i have achieved my aims.[/p][/quote]Poor old Gordon, do send him our good wishes as to his speedy recovery. Tim Newroman

1:38pm Sun 10 Feb 13

Phantom Poster says...

itsamess3 wrote:
Phantom + semi
How you can claim to know what computer skills others have from a social site is beyond belief and archiving is essential in many occupations and very simple to set up.
Far better to have the original information than assumptions.
Perhaps you should both pop down to one of the libraries as i am sure there will be a young child to help you build an archive and the tools to flag up any item. Hurrah for our libraries.
Let us all learn from you - how does your HTML archive system work? Not very good at answering direct questions, are you?
[quote][p][bold]itsamess3[/bold] wrote: Phantom + semi How you can claim to know what computer skills others have from a social site is beyond belief and archiving is essential in many occupations and very simple to set up. Far better to have the original information than assumptions. Perhaps you should both pop down to one of the libraries as i am sure there will be a young child to help you build an archive and the tools to flag up any item. Hurrah for our libraries.[/p][/quote]Let us all learn from you - how does your HTML archive system work? Not very good at answering direct questions, are you? Phantom Poster

1:40pm Sun 10 Feb 13

Phantom Poster says...

By the way, your comments show that you have obviously never been to a local Swindon library.
By the way, your comments show that you have obviously never been to a local Swindon library. Phantom Poster

1:43pm Sun 10 Feb 13

LocalBob80 says...

Wow
Wow LocalBob80

2:21pm Sun 10 Feb 13

itsamess3 says...

"Let us all learn from you - how does your HTML archive system work? Not very good at answering direct questions, are you?”
I do suggest you stop embarrassing yourself further.Let us all learn from you - how does your HTML archive system work?
" By the way, your comments show that you have obviously never been to a local Swindon library.”
Give up as you know nothing.
"Let us all learn from you - how does your HTML archive system work? Not very good at answering direct questions, are you?” I do suggest you stop embarrassing yourself further.Let us all learn from you - how does your HTML archive system work? " By the way, your comments show that you have obviously never been to a local Swindon library.” Give up as you know nothing. itsamess3

2:29pm Sun 10 Feb 13

Phantom Poster says...

Just further confirmation that you are unable to answer any direct questions.

How does your HTML archive system work?
Just further confirmation that you are unable to answer any direct questions. How does your HTML archive system work? Phantom Poster

2:39pm Sun 10 Feb 13

Phantom Poster says...

itsamess3 wrote:
"Let us all learn from you - how does your HTML archive system work? Not very good at answering direct questions, are you?”
I do suggest you stop embarrassing yourself further.Let us all learn from you - how does your HTML archive system work?
" By the way, your comments show that you have obviously never been to a local Swindon library.”
Give up as you know nothing.
So do you do a "save as" in the browser for each news page, remembering to refresh it each time someone posts? Or do you have a screen scraper program to do it automatically? No answer expected!
[quote][p][bold]itsamess3[/bold] wrote: "Let us all learn from you - how does your HTML archive system work? Not very good at answering direct questions, are you?” I do suggest you stop embarrassing yourself further.Let us all learn from you - how does your HTML archive system work? " By the way, your comments show that you have obviously never been to a local Swindon library.” Give up as you know nothing.[/p][/quote]So do you do a "save as" in the browser for each news page, remembering to refresh it each time someone posts? Or do you have a screen scraper program to do it automatically? No answer expected! Phantom Poster

2:43pm Sun 10 Feb 13

Phantom Poster says...

Love it when itsamess is on the ropes! As hapless Bob managed on many occasions!
Love it when itsamess is on the ropes! As hapless Bob managed on many occasions! Phantom Poster

3:17pm Sun 10 Feb 13

Davey Gravey says...

itsamess3 wrote:
Peter
The value of libraries and experienced librarians cannot be denied. I spent endless hours over many years in our reference library and uni libraries as buying books was a drain on my finances. I always found the staff helpul and knowledgable in our libraries.
You are right-the learning through libraries can begin at an early age and in this computer age swindon has taken that on board.
The council should be strengthening the libraries rather than destroying them.
Agree with this. Arming libraries with volunteers is ok for a small local library but not the main ones.


Quit the rubbish though messy as you make yourself look a right idiot. You fool nobody.
[quote][p][bold]itsamess3[/bold] wrote: Peter The value of libraries and experienced librarians cannot be denied. I spent endless hours over many years in our reference library and uni libraries as buying books was a drain on my finances. I always found the staff helpul and knowledgable in our libraries. You are right-the learning through libraries can begin at an early age and in this computer age swindon has taken that on board. The council should be strengthening the libraries rather than destroying them.[/p][/quote]Agree with this. Arming libraries with volunteers is ok for a small local library but not the main ones. Quit the rubbish though messy as you make yourself look a right idiot. You fool nobody. Davey Gravey

3:27pm Sun 10 Feb 13

John Smith II says...

Libraries are a valuable service, for example providing access to all sorts of archived information and out of print books that are otherwise very difficult to come by. Equally the provide an economic form of entertainment for those who can not afford, or do not wish to buy, numerous books.

What surprises me in Swindon is the sheer number of libraries. Based on the 2011 census there are 209,000 people resident in the Borough, served by a grand total of 15 libraries, or roughly one for every 14,000 people. I grew up in a town with a population of around 30,000, served by one well stocked central library, that was easily accessible and had long opening hours, a bit like the one in Swindon.

If I want a particular book today I wouldn't bother with a local Swindon library, I would head straight to the Central Library, which is more likely to have it in stock. Added to which I don't have the benefit of a free bus pass to get there, unlike some others.

I believe that the Borough should continue to provide a strong library service, but that this should be concentrated on a smaller number of sites, which are open for longer than those proposed above. We have to ask ourselves whether libraries are primiarily sources of information and reading material, or free social centres.
Libraries are a valuable service, for example providing access to all sorts of archived information and out of print books that are otherwise very difficult to come by. Equally the provide an economic form of entertainment for those who can not afford, or do not wish to buy, numerous books. What surprises me in Swindon is the sheer number of libraries. Based on the 2011 census there are 209,000 people resident in the Borough, served by a grand total of 15 libraries, or roughly one for every 14,000 people. I grew up in a town with a population of around 30,000, served by one well stocked central library, that was easily accessible and had long opening hours, a bit like the one in Swindon. If I want a particular book today I wouldn't bother with a local Swindon library, I would head straight to the Central Library, which is more likely to have it in stock. Added to which I don't have the benefit of a free bus pass to get there, unlike some others. I believe that the Borough should continue to provide a strong library service, but that this should be concentrated on a smaller number of sites, which are open for longer than those proposed above. We have to ask ourselves whether libraries are primiarily sources of information and reading material, or free social centres. John Smith II

3:52pm Sun 10 Feb 13

Phantom Poster says...

John Smith II wrote:
Libraries are a valuable service, for example providing access to all sorts of archived information and out of print books that are otherwise very difficult to come by. Equally the provide an economic form of entertainment for those who can not afford, or do not wish to buy, numerous books.

What surprises me in Swindon is the sheer number of libraries. Based on the 2011 census there are 209,000 people resident in the Borough, served by a grand total of 15 libraries, or roughly one for every 14,000 people. I grew up in a town with a population of around 30,000, served by one well stocked central library, that was easily accessible and had long opening hours, a bit like the one in Swindon.

If I want a particular book today I wouldn't bother with a local Swindon library, I would head straight to the Central Library, which is more likely to have it in stock. Added to which I don't have the benefit of a free bus pass to get there, unlike some others.

I believe that the Borough should continue to provide a strong library service, but that this should be concentrated on a smaller number of sites, which are open for longer than those proposed above. We have to ask ourselves whether libraries are primiarily sources of information and reading material, or free social centres.
I agree - there should be just one central library.

Why should the lack of a free bus pass make a difference? The reason someone doesn't have a free bus pass is because they are not judged to need one. A day-rider costs £3.50 and for that you get a free book to read! Is it really that expensive?
[quote][p][bold]John Smith II[/bold] wrote: Libraries are a valuable service, for example providing access to all sorts of archived information and out of print books that are otherwise very difficult to come by. Equally the provide an economic form of entertainment for those who can not afford, or do not wish to buy, numerous books. What surprises me in Swindon is the sheer number of libraries. Based on the 2011 census there are 209,000 people resident in the Borough, served by a grand total of 15 libraries, or roughly one for every 14,000 people. I grew up in a town with a population of around 30,000, served by one well stocked central library, that was easily accessible and had long opening hours, a bit like the one in Swindon. If I want a particular book today I wouldn't bother with a local Swindon library, I would head straight to the Central Library, which is more likely to have it in stock. Added to which I don't have the benefit of a free bus pass to get there, unlike some others. I believe that the Borough should continue to provide a strong library service, but that this should be concentrated on a smaller number of sites, which are open for longer than those proposed above. We have to ask ourselves whether libraries are primiarily sources of information and reading material, or free social centres.[/p][/quote]I agree - there should be just one central library. Why should the lack of a free bus pass make a difference? The reason someone doesn't have a free bus pass is because they are not judged to need one. A day-rider costs £3.50 and for that you get a free book to read! Is it really that expensive? Phantom Poster

3:52pm Sun 10 Feb 13

LocalBob80 says...

Having multiple logins is a questionable activity
However, not as disturbing as those that actually invent different
personalities for each of their logins.

It seems those people even argue with themselves to convince us otherwise.

They are easy to spot though because they are the ones with no sense of humour, claim to be middle class, and are very quick to accuse others.
Having multiple logins is a questionable activity However, not as disturbing as those that actually invent different personalities for each of their logins. It seems those people even argue with themselves to convince us otherwise. They are easy to spot though because they are the ones with no sense of humour, claim to be middle class, and are very quick to accuse others. LocalBob80

4:07pm Sun 10 Feb 13

PJC says...

peatmoor pirate wrote:
I use libraries but this approach seems reasonable. The whingers from Old Town Library are a class apart though; it's a short walk or bus ride to the main town library and the machines work just fine everywhere else.
The selection of books in the central library was terrible last time I went, as it seemed they put up a swanky new building then, just dumped all of the old books in there. I stopped going.
[quote][p][bold]peatmoor pirate[/bold] wrote: I use libraries but this approach seems reasonable. The whingers from Old Town Library are a class apart though; it's a short walk or bus ride to the main town library and the machines work just fine everywhere else.[/p][/quote]The selection of books in the central library was terrible last time I went, as it seemed they put up a swanky new building then, just dumped all of the old books in there. I stopped going. PJC

4:09pm Sun 10 Feb 13

PJC says...

Tim Newroman wrote:
Phantom Poster wrote:
Does anyone use libraries anymore? If they do, why isn't access 10 hours a week sufficient, especially if it saves £99K?
Agreed. Anyone seriously interested in using a library doesn't really need it to be open any more than about 3 hours per day, twice a week.
That's silly. So everyone is available for the same 3 hours every week? What about their differing work and/or family commitments?
[quote][p][bold]Tim Newroman[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Phantom Poster[/bold] wrote: Does anyone use libraries anymore? If they do, why isn't access 10 hours a week sufficient, especially if it saves £99K?[/p][/quote]Agreed. Anyone seriously interested in using a library doesn't really need it to be open any more than about 3 hours per day, twice a week.[/p][/quote]That's silly. So everyone is available for the same 3 hours every week? What about their differing work and/or family commitments? PJC

4:12pm Sun 10 Feb 13

Phantom Poster says...

LocalBob80 wrote:
Having multiple logins is a questionable activity
However, not as disturbing as those that actually invent different
personalities for each of their logins.

It seems those people even argue with themselves to convince us otherwise.

They are easy to spot though because they are the ones with no sense of humour, claim to be middle class, and are very quick to accuse others.
Who are they then? You are very quick with accusation, but no facts to back them up!
[quote][p][bold]LocalBob80[/bold] wrote: Having multiple logins is a questionable activity However, not as disturbing as those that actually invent different personalities for each of their logins. It seems those people even argue with themselves to convince us otherwise. They are easy to spot though because they are the ones with no sense of humour, claim to be middle class, and are very quick to accuse others.[/p][/quote]Who are they then? You are very quick with accusation, but no facts to back them up! Phantom Poster

4:21pm Sun 10 Feb 13

Phantom Poster says...

PJC wrote:
Tim Newroman wrote:
Phantom Poster wrote:
Does anyone use libraries anymore? If they do, why isn't access 10 hours a week sufficient, especially if it saves £99K?
Agreed. Anyone seriously interested in using a library doesn't really need it to be open any more than about 3 hours per day, twice a week.
That's silly. So everyone is available for the same 3 hours every week? What about their differing work and/or family commitments?
Oh for FFS, if they are so bloody interested in reading a book then I'm sure that they can manage to get to a library when they are open. As they are no doubt on benefits then they have the whole day to visit the library (ooh controversial!!!)

Why do so many people think that everything should be handed to them on a plate?
[quote][p][bold]PJC[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Tim Newroman[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Phantom Poster[/bold] wrote: Does anyone use libraries anymore? If they do, why isn't access 10 hours a week sufficient, especially if it saves £99K?[/p][/quote]Agreed. Anyone seriously interested in using a library doesn't really need it to be open any more than about 3 hours per day, twice a week.[/p][/quote]That's silly. So everyone is available for the same 3 hours every week? What about their differing work and/or family commitments?[/p][/quote]Oh for FFS, if they are so bloody interested in reading a book then I'm sure that they can manage to get to a library when they are open. As they are no doubt on benefits then they have the whole day to visit the library (ooh controversial!!!) Why do so many people think that everything should be handed to them on a plate? Phantom Poster

4:25pm Sun 10 Feb 13

Phantom Poster says...

PJC wrote:
Tim Newroman wrote:
Phantom Poster wrote:
Does anyone use libraries anymore? If they do, why isn't access 10 hours a week sufficient, especially if it saves £99K?
Agreed. Anyone seriously interested in using a library doesn't really need it to be open any more than about 3 hours per day, twice a week.
That's silly. So everyone is available for the same 3 hours every week? What about their differing work and/or family commitments?
People who work can generally afford to buy a book!
[quote][p][bold]PJC[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Tim Newroman[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Phantom Poster[/bold] wrote: Does anyone use libraries anymore? If they do, why isn't access 10 hours a week sufficient, especially if it saves £99K?[/p][/quote]Agreed. Anyone seriously interested in using a library doesn't really need it to be open any more than about 3 hours per day, twice a week.[/p][/quote]That's silly. So everyone is available for the same 3 hours every week? What about their differing work and/or family commitments?[/p][/quote]People who work can generally afford to buy a book! Phantom Poster

4:32pm Sun 10 Feb 13

PJC says...

Phantom Poster wrote:
PJC wrote:
Tim Newroman wrote:
Phantom Poster wrote:
Does anyone use libraries anymore? If they do, why isn't access 10 hours a week sufficient, especially if it saves £99K?
Agreed. Anyone seriously interested in using a library doesn't really need it to be open any more than about 3 hours per day, twice a week.
That's silly. So everyone is available for the same 3 hours every week? What about their differing work and/or family commitments?
People who work can generally afford to buy a book!
Not if they're on minimum wage.
[quote][p][bold]Phantom Poster[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]PJC[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Tim Newroman[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Phantom Poster[/bold] wrote: Does anyone use libraries anymore? If they do, why isn't access 10 hours a week sufficient, especially if it saves £99K?[/p][/quote]Agreed. Anyone seriously interested in using a library doesn't really need it to be open any more than about 3 hours per day, twice a week.[/p][/quote]That's silly. So everyone is available for the same 3 hours every week? What about their differing work and/or family commitments?[/p][/quote]People who work can generally afford to buy a book![/p][/quote]Not if they're on minimum wage. PJC

4:35pm Sun 10 Feb 13

Phantom Poster says...

PJC wrote:
Phantom Poster wrote:
PJC wrote:
Tim Newroman wrote:
Phantom Poster wrote:
Does anyone use libraries anymore? If they do, why isn't access 10 hours a week sufficient, especially if it saves £99K?
Agreed. Anyone seriously interested in using a library doesn't really need it to be open any more than about 3 hours per day, twice a week.
That's silly. So everyone is available for the same 3 hours every week? What about their differing work and/or family commitments?
People who work can generally afford to buy a book!
Not if they're on minimum wage.
Absolute **** - just cut back on your fags and lager. How much does a book cost and how long does it last?
[quote][p][bold]PJC[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Phantom Poster[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]PJC[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Tim Newroman[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Phantom Poster[/bold] wrote: Does anyone use libraries anymore? If they do, why isn't access 10 hours a week sufficient, especially if it saves £99K?[/p][/quote]Agreed. Anyone seriously interested in using a library doesn't really need it to be open any more than about 3 hours per day, twice a week.[/p][/quote]That's silly. So everyone is available for the same 3 hours every week? What about their differing work and/or family commitments?[/p][/quote]People who work can generally afford to buy a book![/p][/quote]Not if they're on minimum wage.[/p][/quote]Absolute **** - just cut back on your fags and lager. How much does a book cost and how long does it last? Phantom Poster

4:36pm Sun 10 Feb 13

Phantom Poster says...

PJC wrote:
Phantom Poster wrote:
PJC wrote:
Tim Newroman wrote:
Phantom Poster wrote:
Does anyone use libraries anymore? If they do, why isn't access 10 hours a week sufficient, especially if it saves £99K?
Agreed. Anyone seriously interested in using a library doesn't really need it to be open any more than about 3 hours per day, twice a week.
That's silly. So everyone is available for the same 3 hours every week? What about their differing work and/or family commitments?
People who work can generally afford to buy a book!
Not if they're on minimum wage.
I'm guessing that you're not on minimum wage, but feel the need to feel their pain!
[quote][p][bold]PJC[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Phantom Poster[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]PJC[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Tim Newroman[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Phantom Poster[/bold] wrote: Does anyone use libraries anymore? If they do, why isn't access 10 hours a week sufficient, especially if it saves £99K?[/p][/quote]Agreed. Anyone seriously interested in using a library doesn't really need it to be open any more than about 3 hours per day, twice a week.[/p][/quote]That's silly. So everyone is available for the same 3 hours every week? What about their differing work and/or family commitments?[/p][/quote]People who work can generally afford to buy a book![/p][/quote]Not if they're on minimum wage.[/p][/quote]I'm guessing that you're not on minimum wage, but feel the need to feel their pain! Phantom Poster

4:40pm Sun 10 Feb 13

PJC says...

Phantom Poster wrote:
PJC wrote:
Phantom Poster wrote:
PJC wrote:
Tim Newroman wrote:
Phantom Poster wrote:
Does anyone use libraries anymore? If they do, why isn't access 10 hours a week sufficient, especially if it saves £99K?
Agreed. Anyone seriously interested in using a library doesn't really need it to be open any more than about 3 hours per day, twice a week.
That's silly. So everyone is available for the same 3 hours every week? What about their differing work and/or family commitments?
People who work can generally afford to buy a book!
Not if they're on minimum wage.
Absolute **** - just cut back on your fags and lager. How much does a book cost and how long does it last?
I don't smoke or drink lager, and I'm sure many that do wouldn't use libraries anyway. My home is groaning with bought books, but maybe I'd like to not fork out for a book I'm only going to read once. Books are quite expensive unless you go to the charity shops, and most of them are rubbish.
[quote][p][bold]Phantom Poster[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]PJC[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Phantom Poster[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]PJC[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Tim Newroman[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Phantom Poster[/bold] wrote: Does anyone use libraries anymore? If they do, why isn't access 10 hours a week sufficient, especially if it saves £99K?[/p][/quote]Agreed. Anyone seriously interested in using a library doesn't really need it to be open any more than about 3 hours per day, twice a week.[/p][/quote]That's silly. So everyone is available for the same 3 hours every week? What about their differing work and/or family commitments?[/p][/quote]People who work can generally afford to buy a book![/p][/quote]Not if they're on minimum wage.[/p][/quote]Absolute **** - just cut back on your fags and lager. How much does a book cost and how long does it last?[/p][/quote]I don't smoke or drink lager, and I'm sure many that do wouldn't use libraries anyway. My home is groaning with bought books, but maybe I'd like to not fork out for a book I'm only going to read once. Books are quite expensive unless you go to the charity shops, and most of them are rubbish. PJC

4:44pm Sun 10 Feb 13

PJC says...

Phantom Poster wrote:
PJC wrote:
Phantom Poster wrote:
PJC wrote:
Tim Newroman wrote:
Phantom Poster wrote:
Does anyone use libraries anymore? If they do, why isn't access 10 hours a week sufficient, especially if it saves £99K?
Agreed. Anyone seriously interested in using a library doesn't really need it to be open any more than about 3 hours per day, twice a week.
That's silly. So everyone is available for the same 3 hours every week? What about their differing work and/or family commitments?
People who work can generally afford to buy a book!
Not if they're on minimum wage.
I'm guessing that you're not on minimum wage, but feel the need to feel their pain!
55p above minimum wage, actually.
[quote][p][bold]Phantom Poster[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]PJC[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Phantom Poster[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]PJC[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Tim Newroman[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Phantom Poster[/bold] wrote: Does anyone use libraries anymore? If they do, why isn't access 10 hours a week sufficient, especially if it saves £99K?[/p][/quote]Agreed. Anyone seriously interested in using a library doesn't really need it to be open any more than about 3 hours per day, twice a week.[/p][/quote]That's silly. So everyone is available for the same 3 hours every week? What about their differing work and/or family commitments?[/p][/quote]People who work can generally afford to buy a book![/p][/quote]Not if they're on minimum wage.[/p][/quote]I'm guessing that you're not on minimum wage, but feel the need to feel their pain![/p][/quote]55p above minimum wage, actually. PJC

4:48pm Sun 10 Feb 13

itsamess3 says...

Love it when itsamess is on the ropes! As hapless Bob managed on many occasions!”
You really are dim- you not know what HTML is? Your system must be very old-far simpler to transfer data to an external drive with tools with keywords to bring up relevant posts. We have had these systems in place for years to access research papers for quick reference.

Nice to see you are now commenting on the article--although you do not appreciate the value of the different grades of libraries as local ones cannot provide all the services. To rely on just the central library is hardly viable for a plethora of reasons. One major one being that not all consumers just use them to loan books.
Love it when itsamess is on the ropes! As hapless Bob managed on many occasions!” You really are dim- you not know what HTML is? Your system must be very old-far simpler to transfer data to an external drive with tools with keywords to bring up relevant posts. We have had these systems in place for years to access research papers for quick reference. Nice to see you are now commenting on the article--although you do not appreciate the value of the different grades of libraries as local ones cannot provide all the services. To rely on just the central library is hardly viable for a plethora of reasons. One major one being that not all consumers just use them to loan books. itsamess3

5:07pm Sun 10 Feb 13

Phantom Poster says...

itsamess3 wrote:
Love it when itsamess is on the ropes! As hapless Bob managed on many occasions!”
You really are dim- you not know what HTML is? Your system must be very old-far simpler to transfer data to an external drive with tools with keywords to bring up relevant posts. We have had these systems in place for years to access research papers for quick reference.

Nice to see you are now commenting on the article--although you do not appreciate the value of the different grades of libraries as local ones cannot provide all the services. To rely on just the central library is hardly viable for a plethora of reasons. One major one being that not all consumers just use them to loan books.
You still can't answer a simple question!
[quote][p][bold]itsamess3[/bold] wrote: Love it when itsamess is on the ropes! As hapless Bob managed on many occasions!” You really are dim- you not know what HTML is? Your system must be very old-far simpler to transfer data to an external drive with tools with keywords to bring up relevant posts. We have had these systems in place for years to access research papers for quick reference. Nice to see you are now commenting on the article--although you do not appreciate the value of the different grades of libraries as local ones cannot provide all the services. To rely on just the central library is hardly viable for a plethora of reasons. One major one being that not all consumers just use them to loan books.[/p][/quote]You still can't answer a simple question! Phantom Poster

5:12pm Sun 10 Feb 13

Phantom Poster says...

itsamess3 wrote:
Love it when itsamess is on the ropes! As hapless Bob managed on many occasions!”
You really are dim- you not know what HTML is? Your system must be very old-far simpler to transfer data to an external drive with tools with keywords to bring up relevant posts. We have had these systems in place for years to access research papers for quick reference.

Nice to see you are now commenting on the article--although you do not appreciate the value of the different grades of libraries as local ones cannot provide all the services. To rely on just the central library is hardly viable for a plethora of reasons. One major one being that not all consumers just use them to loan books.
Can I ask a more simple question? How do you transfer the HTML from the Swindon Advertiser web site to a database which you can search?

It's pretty obvious that you don't have the skills to do so!
[quote][p][bold]itsamess3[/bold] wrote: Love it when itsamess is on the ropes! As hapless Bob managed on many occasions!” You really are dim- you not know what HTML is? Your system must be very old-far simpler to transfer data to an external drive with tools with keywords to bring up relevant posts. We have had these systems in place for years to access research papers for quick reference. Nice to see you are now commenting on the article--although you do not appreciate the value of the different grades of libraries as local ones cannot provide all the services. To rely on just the central library is hardly viable for a plethora of reasons. One major one being that not all consumers just use them to loan books.[/p][/quote]Can I ask a more simple question? How do you transfer the HTML from the Swindon Advertiser web site to a database which you can search? It's pretty obvious that you don't have the skills to do so! Phantom Poster

5:15pm Sun 10 Feb 13

Phantom Poster says...

Phantom Poster wrote:
itsamess3 wrote:
Love it when itsamess is on the ropes! As hapless Bob managed on many occasions!”
You really are dim- you not know what HTML is? Your system must be very old-far simpler to transfer data to an external drive with tools with keywords to bring up relevant posts. We have had these systems in place for years to access research papers for quick reference.

Nice to see you are now commenting on the article--although you do not appreciate the value of the different grades of libraries as local ones cannot provide all the services. To rely on just the central library is hardly viable for a plethora of reasons. One major one being that not all consumers just use them to loan books.
Can I ask a more simple question? How do you transfer the HTML from the Swindon Advertiser web site to a database which you can search?

It's pretty obvious that you don't have the skills to do so!
How do you deal with the fact that the pages on hare are constantly updated with new posts?
[quote][p][bold]Phantom Poster[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]itsamess3[/bold] wrote: Love it when itsamess is on the ropes! As hapless Bob managed on many occasions!” You really are dim- you not know what HTML is? Your system must be very old-far simpler to transfer data to an external drive with tools with keywords to bring up relevant posts. We have had these systems in place for years to access research papers for quick reference. Nice to see you are now commenting on the article--although you do not appreciate the value of the different grades of libraries as local ones cannot provide all the services. To rely on just the central library is hardly viable for a plethora of reasons. One major one being that not all consumers just use them to loan books.[/p][/quote]Can I ask a more simple question? How do you transfer the HTML from the Swindon Advertiser web site to a database which you can search? It's pretty obvious that you don't have the skills to do so![/p][/quote]How do you deal with the fact that the pages on hare are constantly updated with new posts? Phantom Poster

5:22pm Sun 10 Feb 13

Phantom Poster says...

itsamess3 - so what happened to itsamess, itsamess1 and itamess2?

Don't like talking about your past, do you? Still operating your "covert" cameras outside the Carpenter?

Pathetic.
itsamess3 - so what happened to itsamess, itsamess1 and itamess2? Don't like talking about your past, do you? Still operating your "covert" cameras outside the Carpenter? Pathetic. Phantom Poster

5:29pm Sun 10 Feb 13

Phantom Poster says...

Phantom Poster wrote:
itsamess3 wrote:
Love it when itsamess is on the ropes! As hapless Bob managed on many occasions!”
You really are dim- you not know what HTML is? Your system must be very old-far simpler to transfer data to an external drive with tools with keywords to bring up relevant posts. We have had these systems in place for years to access research papers for quick reference.

Nice to see you are now commenting on the article--although you do not appreciate the value of the different grades of libraries as local ones cannot provide all the services. To rely on just the central library is hardly viable for a plethora of reasons. One major one being that not all consumers just use them to loan books.
Can I ask a more simple question? How do you transfer the HTML from the Swindon Advertiser web site to a database which you can search?

It's pretty obvious that you don't have the skills to do so!
I so love to see you squirm! I'm so looking forward to your reply which will have absolutly no relevance to subject
[quote][p][bold]Phantom Poster[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]itsamess3[/bold] wrote: Love it when itsamess is on the ropes! As hapless Bob managed on many occasions!” You really are dim- you not know what HTML is? Your system must be very old-far simpler to transfer data to an external drive with tools with keywords to bring up relevant posts. We have had these systems in place for years to access research papers for quick reference. Nice to see you are now commenting on the article--although you do not appreciate the value of the different grades of libraries as local ones cannot provide all the services. To rely on just the central library is hardly viable for a plethora of reasons. One major one being that not all consumers just use them to loan books.[/p][/quote]Can I ask a more simple question? How do you transfer the HTML from the Swindon Advertiser web site to a database which you can search? It's pretty obvious that you don't have the skills to do so![/p][/quote]I so love to see you squirm! I'm so looking forward to your reply which will have absolutly no relevance to subject Phantom Poster

5:44pm Sun 10 Feb 13

Trevor Craig says...

Some rather weird arguments going on above. Some figures to give a bit of context first. They are saving 99k by cutting the hours and the front line, low paid library managers and assistants in libraries. The chief exec of Swindon is paid a basic salary of 161k a year, probably a lot higher once you put in the pension and benefits, its a lot more than the prime ministers 142k basic. Swindon council has 115 staff on over 50k a year. The obvious maths says that cutting any two of those 115 staff would save the front line libraries from cuts. Political parties talk about bridging the gap between the rich and the poor and bang on about aspiration. Anyone who uses a library knows that this is what they provide, books, reading and knowledge help people to better themselves and get on in life. It doesn't appear on the annual balance sheet for councils so for them it doesn't seem to matter. But the thing is that a persons chances in life are improved by libraries and when you cut them in many years to come there will be more people who didn't do as well as they could have and have to rely on the state for their pensions and care. Politicians cannot think more than four years ahead sadly. Library usage has, despite the cuts in the last few years held up really well and usage from children is actually increasing which is great news, this is despite the rise of kindle and the internet which is supposed to have killed the library off. TV was supposed to kill radio but its still going strong. Finally libraries are a statutory service and authorities have to provide a "comprehensive and efficient library service for all persons desiring to make use thereof" if the council wants to break the law i'm sure the government won't stop them but it will be at great cost. It would be easier to find the 99k from 115 senior staff if I were in charge.
Some rather weird arguments going on above. Some figures to give a bit of context first. They are saving 99k by cutting the hours and the front line, low paid library managers and assistants in libraries. The chief exec of Swindon is paid a basic salary of 161k a year, probably a lot higher once you put in the pension and benefits, its a lot more than the prime ministers 142k basic. Swindon council has 115 staff on over 50k a year. The obvious maths says that cutting any two of those 115 staff would save the front line libraries from cuts. Political parties talk about bridging the gap between the rich and the poor and bang on about aspiration. Anyone who uses a library knows that this is what they provide, books, reading and knowledge help people to better themselves and get on in life. It doesn't appear on the annual balance sheet for councils so for them it doesn't seem to matter. But the thing is that a persons chances in life are improved by libraries and when you cut them in many years to come there will be more people who didn't do as well as they could have and have to rely on the state for their pensions and care. Politicians cannot think more than four years ahead sadly. Library usage has, despite the cuts in the last few years held up really well and usage from children is actually increasing which is great news, this is despite the rise of kindle and the internet which is supposed to have killed the library off. TV was supposed to kill radio but its still going strong. Finally libraries are a statutory service and authorities have to provide a "comprehensive and efficient library service for all persons desiring to make use thereof" if the council wants to break the law i'm sure the government won't stop them but it will be at great cost. It would be easier to find the 99k from 115 senior staff if I were in charge. Trevor Craig

6:29pm Sun 10 Feb 13

itsamess3 says...

P.P
You are simply being abusive and disrupting the thread on matters that have no bearing whatsoever.
Iam quite sure you are simply aggrieved because you cannot solve a very simple procedure to archive material for personal use.

You have given your opinion on the libraries and we disagree-so unless you have nothing to say on that we have nothing to debate.
P.P You are simply being abusive and disrupting the thread on matters that have no bearing whatsoever. Iam quite sure you are simply aggrieved because you cannot solve a very simple procedure to archive material for personal use. You have given your opinion on the libraries and we disagree-so unless you have nothing to say on that we have nothing to debate. itsamess3

7:01pm Sun 10 Feb 13

semitonic says...

Oh dear, poor messy has finally realised he has absolutely no idea what he thought he was talking about.

Perhaps Gordon can come on here and spare his blushes - go on messy, just once more for old time's sake, I could do with cheering up on this bleak winter evening.
Oh dear, poor messy has finally realised he has absolutely no idea what he thought he was talking about. Perhaps Gordon can come on here and spare his blushes - go on messy, just once more for old time's sake, I could do with cheering up on this bleak winter evening. semitonic

7:59pm Sun 10 Feb 13

itsamess3 says...

Semi
No blushes here-do grow up.
Semi No blushes here-do grow up. itsamess3

8:08pm Sun 10 Feb 13

Davey Gravey says...

itsamess3 wrote:
Semi
No blushes here-do grow up.
As you document every article on here, maybe you should read back what you've said previously? You employ the same tactics when challenged by people and it does you no favours.
[quote][p][bold]itsamess3[/bold] wrote: Semi No blushes here-do grow up.[/p][/quote]As you document every article on here, maybe you should read back what you've said previously? You employ the same tactics when challenged by people and it does you no favours. Davey Gravey

9:00pm Sun 10 Feb 13

LocalBob80 says...

Wow!
Wow! LocalBob80

8:30am Mon 11 Feb 13

Tim Newroman says...

PJC wrote:
Tim Newroman wrote:
Phantom Poster wrote:
Does anyone use libraries anymore? If they do, why isn't access 10 hours a week sufficient, especially if it saves £99K?
Agreed. Anyone seriously interested in using a library doesn't really need it to be open any more than about 3 hours per day, twice a week.
That's silly. So everyone is available for the same 3 hours every week? What about their differing work and/or family commitments?
As I said before, if you have to cater to every person's differing work and/or family commitments, you have to open 24 hours a day. There will always be someone who insists that their only moment of free time is 3am Tuesday morning.

My point was that anyone who seriously needs/wants to visit a library should be able to make time to visit one during an opening time of 3 hours per day, two days per week.

Obviously it should be based on some degree of user research, but, for example, if you opened the library from 4pm until 7pm on a Wednesday evening and then 11am to 2pm on a Saturday afternoon, it would be a fairly strange work/family life arrangement that would completely prevent you from being able to use the library.

And let's cut all the silly 'what about poor people?' malarky. A far wider range of books is available on eBay than almost any town centre library and you can pick most of them up for pennies.

The implication that there may be legions of benefit recipients hiring out works of literary brilliance every other day is quite amusing, though.
[quote][p][bold]PJC[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Tim Newroman[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Phantom Poster[/bold] wrote: Does anyone use libraries anymore? If they do, why isn't access 10 hours a week sufficient, especially if it saves £99K?[/p][/quote]Agreed. Anyone seriously interested in using a library doesn't really need it to be open any more than about 3 hours per day, twice a week.[/p][/quote]That's silly. So everyone is available for the same 3 hours every week? What about their differing work and/or family commitments?[/p][/quote]As I said before, if you have to cater to every person's differing work and/or family commitments, you have to open 24 hours a day. There will always be someone who insists that their only moment of free time is 3am Tuesday morning. [p] My point was that anyone who seriously needs/wants to visit a library should be able to make time to visit one during an opening time of 3 hours per day, two days per week. [p] Obviously it should be based on some degree of user research, but, for example, if you opened the library from 4pm until 7pm on a Wednesday evening and then 11am to 2pm on a Saturday afternoon, it would be a fairly strange work/family life arrangement that would completely prevent you from being able to use the library. [p] And let's cut all the silly 'what about poor people?' malarky. A far wider range of books is available on eBay than almost any town centre library and you can pick most of them up for pennies. [p] The implication that there may be legions of benefit recipients hiring out works of literary brilliance every other day is quite amusing, though. Tim Newroman

8:56am Mon 11 Feb 13

Tim Newroman says...

itsamess3 wrote:
Love it when itsamess is on the ropes! As hapless Bob managed on many occasions!”
You really are dim- you not know what HTML is? Your system must be very old-far simpler to transfer data to an external drive with tools with keywords to bring up relevant posts. We have had these systems in place for years to access research papers for quick reference.

Nice to see you are now commenting on the article--although you do not appreciate the value of the different grades of libraries as local ones cannot provide all the services. To rely on just the central library is hardly viable for a plethora of reasons. One major one being that not all consumers just use them to loan books.
Interesting to note that itsamess3 has very publically and openly admitted to breaking the Adver website's terms and conditions.

Not doubt we'll now see the usual backtracking or comments about how he's obtained 'special permission' to copy and archive the material, but a quick scan through the Adver's published T&Cs confirms:


No part of the Site can be reproduced on, transmitted to or stored on any other web site or other form of electronic retrieval system


Do tell us again how you arrange for the site data to be transferred to, and stored on, your external hard drive. Something you admit to having done for years.
[quote][p][bold]itsamess3[/bold] wrote: Love it when itsamess is on the ropes! As hapless Bob managed on many occasions!” You really are dim- you not know what HTML is? Your system must be very old-far simpler to transfer data to an external drive with tools with keywords to bring up relevant posts. We have had these systems in place for years to access research papers for quick reference. Nice to see you are now commenting on the article--although you do not appreciate the value of the different grades of libraries as local ones cannot provide all the services. To rely on just the central library is hardly viable for a plethora of reasons. One major one being that not all consumers just use them to loan books.[/p][/quote]Interesting to note that itsamess3 has very publically and openly admitted to breaking the Adver website's terms and conditions. [p] Not doubt we'll now see the usual backtracking or comments about how he's obtained 'special permission' to copy and archive the material, but a quick scan through the Adver's published T&Cs confirms: [p] [quote] No part of the Site can be reproduced on, transmitted to or stored on any other web site or other form of electronic retrieval system [/quote] [p] Do tell us again how you arrange for the site data to be transferred to, and stored on, your external hard drive. Something you admit to having done for years. Tim Newroman

9:59am Mon 11 Feb 13

LocalBob80 says...

Err... What happened to your previous login?
Err... What happened to [bold] your [/bold] previous login? LocalBob80

10:03am Mon 11 Feb 13

Gypsy Moon says...

Going back to the actual subject of the article.....perhaps SBC need to look at how WCC run their libraries. Purton is staffed by volunteers and runs very well. Not saying that we need to be completely run on a volunteer basis but the use of volunteers could be good for both costs and customer service.
Going back to the actual subject of the article.....perhaps SBC need to look at how WCC run their libraries. Purton is staffed by volunteers and runs very well. Not saying that we need to be completely run on a volunteer basis but the use of volunteers could be good for both costs and customer service. Gypsy Moon

10:45am Mon 11 Feb 13

itsamess3 says...

Tim/I2/mr blackwell/oliver
Do also read the T&Cs to comment on the articles.

No part of the Site can be reproduced on, transmitted to or stored on any other web site or other form of electronic retrieval system.

As a registered user-provided nothing i saved from the site to a personal adchive for my reference is not transmitted to external web sites or retreival systems no rules are breached.
In law it is a breach of copyright to reproduce any part of the adver on sites such as twitter/facebook without their permission.
Do continue your comments as to the library issue-we all know the council will do as they please and nothing you or i or anyone else will change that.
Tim/I2/mr blackwell/oliver Do also read the T&Cs to comment on the articles. No part of the Site can be reproduced on, transmitted to or stored on any other web site or other form of electronic retrieval system. As a registered user-provided nothing i saved from the site to a personal adchive for my reference is not transmitted to external web sites or retreival systems no rules are breached. In law it is a breach of copyright to reproduce any part of the adver on sites such as twitter/facebook without their permission. Do continue your comments as to the library issue-we all know the council will do as they please and nothing you or i or anyone else will change that. itsamess3

10:56am Mon 11 Feb 13

itsamess3 says...

Gypsy moon
Many countries provide very high quality libraries with both lending and sales all within one building. From pens to computers or any product or service the library gives including meals and snacks.
Gypsy moon Many countries provide very high quality libraries with both lending and sales all within one building. From pens to computers or any product or service the library gives including meals and snacks. itsamess3

11:01am Mon 11 Feb 13

Tim Newroman says...

@itsamess3: what, exactly, do you think your saved, searchable copies of the Adver site on your external hard drive is if it's not 'stored on any form of electronic retrieval system'?
@itsamess3: what, exactly, do you think your saved, searchable copies of the Adver site on your external hard drive is if it's not 'stored on any form of electronic retrieval system'? Tim Newroman

11:57am Mon 11 Feb 13

itsamess3 says...

Sorry--i have nothing to add as you have no valid point as all material never goes to external sites.
Sorry--i have nothing to add as you have no valid point as all material never goes to external sites. itsamess3

1:04pm Mon 11 Feb 13

dglaholm says...

John Smith II wrote:
Libraries are a valuable service, for example providing access to all sorts of archived information and out of print books that are otherwise very difficult to come by. Equally the provide an economic form of entertainment for those who can not afford, or do not wish to buy, numerous books.

What surprises me in Swindon is the sheer number of libraries. Based on the 2011 census there are 209,000 people resident in the Borough, served by a grand total of 15 libraries, or roughly one for every 14,000 people. I grew up in a town with a population of around 30,000, served by one well stocked central library, that was easily accessible and had long opening hours, a bit like the one in Swindon.

If I want a particular book today I wouldn't bother with a local Swindon library, I would head straight to the Central Library, which is more likely to have it in stock. Added to which I don't have the benefit of a free bus pass to get there, unlike some others.

I believe that the Borough should continue to provide a strong library service, but that this should be concentrated on a smaller number of sites, which are open for longer than those proposed above. We have to ask ourselves whether libraries are primiarily sources of information and reading material, or free social centres.
A sensible suggestion at last..Coupled of course with greater use of Mobile libraries to access rural communities.
[quote][p][bold]John Smith II[/bold] wrote: Libraries are a valuable service, for example providing access to all sorts of archived information and out of print books that are otherwise very difficult to come by. Equally the provide an economic form of entertainment for those who can not afford, or do not wish to buy, numerous books. What surprises me in Swindon is the sheer number of libraries. Based on the 2011 census there are 209,000 people resident in the Borough, served by a grand total of 15 libraries, or roughly one for every 14,000 people. I grew up in a town with a population of around 30,000, served by one well stocked central library, that was easily accessible and had long opening hours, a bit like the one in Swindon. If I want a particular book today I wouldn't bother with a local Swindon library, I would head straight to the Central Library, which is more likely to have it in stock. Added to which I don't have the benefit of a free bus pass to get there, unlike some others. I believe that the Borough should continue to provide a strong library service, but that this should be concentrated on a smaller number of sites, which are open for longer than those proposed above. We have to ask ourselves whether libraries are primiarily sources of information and reading material, or free social centres.[/p][/quote]A sensible suggestion at last..Coupled of course with greater use of Mobile libraries to access rural communities. dglaholm

3:37pm Mon 11 Feb 13

Tim Newroman says...

itsamess3 wrote:
Sorry--i have nothing to add as you have no valid point as all material never goes to external sites.
Thank you for the apology. I shall let you know if I choose to accept it.
[quote][p][bold]itsamess3[/bold] wrote: Sorry--i have nothing to add as you have no valid point as all material never goes to external sites.[/p][/quote]Thank you for the apology. I shall let you know if I choose to accept it. Tim Newroman

4:04pm Mon 11 Feb 13

PJC says...

Tim Newroman wrote:
PJC wrote:
Tim Newroman wrote:
Phantom Poster wrote:
Does anyone use libraries anymore? If they do, why isn't access 10 hours a week sufficient, especially if it saves £99K?
Agreed. Anyone seriously interested in using a library doesn't really need it to be open any more than about 3 hours per day, twice a week.
That's silly. So everyone is available for the same 3 hours every week? What about their differing work and/or family commitments?
As I said before, if you have to cater to every person's differing work and/or family commitments, you have to open 24 hours a day. There will always be someone who insists that their only moment of free time is 3am Tuesday morning.

My point was that anyone who seriously needs/wants to visit a library should be able to make time to visit one during an opening time of 3 hours per day, two days per week.

Obviously it should be based on some degree of user research, but, for example, if you opened the library from 4pm until 7pm on a Wednesday evening and then 11am to 2pm on a Saturday afternoon, it would be a fairly strange work/family life arrangement that would completely prevent you from being able to use the library.

And let's cut all the silly 'what about poor people?' malarky. A far wider range of books is available on eBay than almost any town centre library and you can pick most of them up for pennies.

The implication that there may be legions of benefit recipients hiring out works of literary brilliance every other day is quite amusing, though.
Quite the snob. So all people on benefits are stupid, are they? I'm not on benefits personally, just a low wage. Does that mean I'm not allowed to improve my mind? What about those who work shifts that don't fit in with the opening hours? Also, who are you to judge other people's domestic arrangements. Maybe you are independently wealthy and can come and go as you please?
[quote][p][bold]Tim Newroman[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]PJC[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Tim Newroman[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Phantom Poster[/bold] wrote: Does anyone use libraries anymore? If they do, why isn't access 10 hours a week sufficient, especially if it saves £99K?[/p][/quote]Agreed. Anyone seriously interested in using a library doesn't really need it to be open any more than about 3 hours per day, twice a week.[/p][/quote]That's silly. So everyone is available for the same 3 hours every week? What about their differing work and/or family commitments?[/p][/quote]As I said before, if you have to cater to every person's differing work and/or family commitments, you have to open 24 hours a day. There will always be someone who insists that their only moment of free time is 3am Tuesday morning. [p] My point was that anyone who seriously needs/wants to visit a library should be able to make time to visit one during an opening time of 3 hours per day, two days per week. [p] Obviously it should be based on some degree of user research, but, for example, if you opened the library from 4pm until 7pm on a Wednesday evening and then 11am to 2pm on a Saturday afternoon, it would be a fairly strange work/family life arrangement that would completely prevent you from being able to use the library. [p] And let's cut all the silly 'what about poor people?' malarky. A far wider range of books is available on eBay than almost any town centre library and you can pick most of them up for pennies. [p] The implication that there may be legions of benefit recipients hiring out works of literary brilliance every other day is quite amusing, though.[/p][/quote]Quite the snob. So all people on benefits are stupid, are they? I'm not on benefits personally, just a low wage. Does that mean I'm not allowed to improve my mind? What about those who work shifts that don't fit in with the opening hours? Also, who are you to judge other people's domestic arrangements. Maybe you are independently wealthy and can come and go as you please? PJC

11:08pm Mon 11 Feb 13

Tim Newroman says...

PJC wrote:
Tim Newroman wrote:
PJC wrote:
Tim Newroman wrote:
Phantom Poster wrote:
Does anyone use libraries anymore? If they do, why isn't access 10 hours a week sufficient, especially if it saves £99K?
Agreed. Anyone seriously interested in using a library doesn't really need it to be open any more than about 3 hours per day, twice a week.
That's silly. So everyone is available for the same 3 hours every week? What about their differing work and/or family commitments?
As I said before, if you have to cater to every person's differing work and/or family commitments, you have to open 24 hours a day. There will always be someone who insists that their only moment of free time is 3am Tuesday morning.

My point was that anyone who seriously needs/wants to visit a library should be able to make time to visit one during an opening time of 3 hours per day, two days per week.

Obviously it should be based on some degree of user research, but, for example, if you opened the library from 4pm until 7pm on a Wednesday evening and then 11am to 2pm on a Saturday afternoon, it would be a fairly strange work/family life arrangement that would completely prevent you from being able to use the library.

And let's cut all the silly 'what about poor people?' malarky. A far wider range of books is available on eBay than almost any town centre library and you can pick most of them up for pennies.

The implication that there may be legions of benefit recipients hiring out works of literary brilliance every other day is quite amusing, though.
Quite the snob. So all people on benefits are stupid, are they? I'm not on benefits personally, just a low wage. Does that mean I'm not allowed to improve my mind? What about those who work shifts that don't fit in with the opening hours? Also, who are you to judge other people's domestic arrangements. Maybe you are independently wealthy and can come and go as you please?
Oh dear.
[quote][p][bold]PJC[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Tim Newroman[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]PJC[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Tim Newroman[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Phantom Poster[/bold] wrote: Does anyone use libraries anymore? If they do, why isn't access 10 hours a week sufficient, especially if it saves £99K?[/p][/quote]Agreed. Anyone seriously interested in using a library doesn't really need it to be open any more than about 3 hours per day, twice a week.[/p][/quote]That's silly. So everyone is available for the same 3 hours every week? What about their differing work and/or family commitments?[/p][/quote]As I said before, if you have to cater to every person's differing work and/or family commitments, you have to open 24 hours a day. There will always be someone who insists that their only moment of free time is 3am Tuesday morning. [p] My point was that anyone who seriously needs/wants to visit a library should be able to make time to visit one during an opening time of 3 hours per day, two days per week. [p] Obviously it should be based on some degree of user research, but, for example, if you opened the library from 4pm until 7pm on a Wednesday evening and then 11am to 2pm on a Saturday afternoon, it would be a fairly strange work/family life arrangement that would completely prevent you from being able to use the library. [p] And let's cut all the silly 'what about poor people?' malarky. A far wider range of books is available on eBay than almost any town centre library and you can pick most of them up for pennies. [p] The implication that there may be legions of benefit recipients hiring out works of literary brilliance every other day is quite amusing, though.[/p][/quote]Quite the snob. So all people on benefits are stupid, are they? I'm not on benefits personally, just a low wage. Does that mean I'm not allowed to improve my mind? What about those who work shifts that don't fit in with the opening hours? Also, who are you to judge other people's domestic arrangements. Maybe you are independently wealthy and can come and go as you please?[/p][/quote]Oh dear. Tim Newroman

7:32pm Tue 12 Feb 13

Fartim Poster says...

How sad
How sad Fartim Poster

7:32pm Tue 12 Feb 13

Fartim Poster says...

How sad
How sad Fartim Poster

8:22pm Wed 13 Feb 13

Tim Newroman says...

Fartim Poster wrote:
How sad
Nevermind, cheer yourself up a bit. Maybe go dancing.
[quote][p][bold]Fartim Poster[/bold] wrote: How sad[/p][/quote]Nevermind, cheer yourself up a bit. Maybe go dancing. Tim Newroman

Comments are closed on this article.

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