‘Canal can still run through our town’ (From Swindon Advertiser)
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‘Canal can still run through our town’
11:10pm Thursday 27th August 2009 in News
THE dream of a canal running through Swindon town centre has not been dimmed by the recession.
The £75m scheme to run a waterway through Swindon to link up with the national canal network is included in Swindon Council’s draft core strategy – a vision for the town in 2026.
Council leader Rod Bluh said work was still underway to secure funding for the project, but said his administration was still committed to the scheme in principle.
He said: “A canal has huge potential if people could get their minds around it but it is going to cost £75m and the challenge now is to find a way of funding that.”
The project attracted controversy when details first became public last year, but according to the chairman of the Swindon branch of the Wilts and Berks Canal Trust the mood of the public has changed.
Keith Dowdy said: “People coming into our shop in Theatre Square have been quite positive. When they come to us they get the truth and then they understand a lot more about it. A lot of the negative comments we got were based on flawed logic.
“People seemed to be under the impression that this would just be a cul-de-sac of water in the town centre, whereas the canal would link up with the national network.”
Mr Dowdy said a canal would not only be a draw to boaters.
He said: “This is also about cyclists, walkers, families. It would bring wildlife back to the area and it would be a great boom to the economy. An independent report estimated a canal could bring in £8m annually to the local economy.”
Roy Cartwright, 64, a fellow canal enthusiast, said: “If we are going to compete with places like Cabot Circus this is what we need.
“I went out to Gloucester Docks recently and I remember thinking there is nothing to compete with this in Swindon.
“If we don’t do something we will be left behind.”
The council’s proposed route along Westcott Place, Faringdon Road and Fleet Street was given the thumbs up by a Government planning inspector in January.
According to Coun Phil Young, the cabinet member in charge of the project, officers are now investigating how funding could be secured.
“This is the big challenge because obviously there is less funding around at the moment,” he said.
“The canal is an aspiration at the moment and now we have to look at the issue of deliverability.
“I would hope that within the next few months we will be able to report on that.”
More information about the core strategy can be found at a public exhibition in North Swindon Library from noon to 6pm today.
Comments(47)
stoned
says...
11:35pm Thu 27 Aug 09
itsamess
says...
12:28am Fri 28 Aug 09
Support_British_Manufacturing
says...
7:14am Fri 28 Aug 09
dc the 2nd
says...
8:42am Fri 28 Aug 09
Imagine strolling down the canal, past the 99p shop, avoiding the drunken great-unwashed to the marina where you can buy a latte and watch the human waste (walking or not) drift by.
BadProspects
says...
9:02am Fri 28 Aug 09
If we're going to spend all those millions on some sort of heritage project, why not spend it on the Mechanics? (and avoid ripping up half the town in the process)
Home Boy
says...
10:02am Fri 28 Aug 09
Richard T
says...
10:25am Fri 28 Aug 09
Anywhere else - little Pennine towns like Slaithwaite, Banbury, Gloucester, Birmingham - the canal becomes a focus for regeneration. By having a canal there you attract more people, and hence more business, because the town actually becomes a pleasant place.
No-one, but no-one, actually wants to go anywhere in Swindon except the Outlet Centre. That's because the place is an utter sink-hole. I don't have a lot of time for Rod Bluh but he's right on this - we've got to do something really dramatic to the town centre to ever make people want to visit here, and the canal is the best idea yet.
Bobfm
says...
10:30am Fri 28 Aug 09
Does that imply that Muse as well as Modus have dropped out?
There were questions a couple of days ago about New Swindon Company and Peter James. A little birdie has told me that PJ was told to fall on his sword.
Be interesting to see which project he heads up next. As an off shoot of the SWRDA, he couldn't just be sacked, even though I suspect the majority of Swindon residents would have happily delivered his P45.
Support_British_Manufacturing
says...
10:48am Fri 28 Aug 09
itsamess
says...
11:03am Fri 28 Aug 09
Mr_Big
says...
11:13am Fri 28 Aug 09
BadProspects wrote:That would be flogging a dead horse with regards to the Mechanics. I think its fantastic that the canal dream has not been dimmed by the recession.
Its also not true for the 'canalies' to state that the canal won't be a dead-ended cul-de-sac. I went into the Theatre Square shop and was told quite clearly that even after completion, it won't link through at both ends for another 20+ years. If we're going to spend all those millions on some sort of heritage project, why not spend it on the Mechanics? (and avoid ripping up half the town in the process)
"Keith Dowdy said: “People coming into our shop in Theatre Square have been quite positive. When they come to us they get the truth and then they understand a lot more about it."
Then Badprospects comes trundling through the door…. and Keith says " A lot of the negative comments we got were based on flawed logic."
Badprospects, a total pity you degraded to insulting me on “Putting Swindon on the Tourist Trail” story which has subsequently vanished due to its content.
Shame on you, most of us are adults on here. If you don’t agree with my thoughts – I don’t care, I am entitled to my opinion and will not be deterred or bullied from doing so.
If you can’t use this forum properly, please do not use it at all.
Thank-you.
BWB
says...
12:17pm Fri 28 Aug 09
itsamess wrote:Those in high positions have nothing to fear.
Stating the obvious our Bob--no doubt in the future we will discover how much his golden handshake was and pension we have to pay for. Time to weed out the councillors and advisers who have cost the people of Swindon- golden opportunities lost through incompetence and more concerned at sitting on outside groups just to boost their income.
Im taking a risk,but perhaps you should copy and paste the following link. It will open your eyes to what goes on.
http://video.google.
com/videoplay?docid=
2748614967389038944&
hl=en
itsamess
says...
12:23pm Fri 28 Aug 09
BadProspects
says...
12:30pm Fri 28 Aug 09
....
I repeat back to you your own words as they apply equally to you:
...
"If you don’t agree with my thoughts – I don’t care, I am entitled to my opinion and will not be deterred or bullied from doing so. If you can’t use this forum properly, please do not use it at all. "
Throwing a hissy because I called you *a troll* (how insulting!) because of YOUR rude reply to itsamess hardly demonstrates your status as an 'adult' does it? Or am I missing some special status which exempts you when it comes to manners?
;-)
Back ON topic - fact remains that the canal will only be joined at one end - meaning it literally IS a cul-de-sac for at least the next 20 years
Bobfm
says...
12:44pm Fri 28 Aug 09
BadProspects
says...
12:49pm Fri 28 Aug 09
cookie32
says...
12:50pm Fri 28 Aug 09
-
So the canal will cost £52m (x that by 2 everybody, if it's a local government contract) and it'll bring in an estimated £8m; so 13 years after it's constructed it'll break even but then we'll all have higher council tax as well to a)pay for it b)pay for the clean up after every weekend.
_
Let's not forget that 20 years is the lead time on it being connected as a through route, so that'll be 33 years before it starts to pay for itself and boost revenues!
_
What an utter waste of time and money; and it'll bring Wildlife to the area... the only wildlife it will bring in the town centre are the animals that seem to stalk our gutters, but then hopefully natural selection will prevail!
BadProspects
says...
12:54pm Fri 28 Aug 09
itsamess
says...
12:57pm Fri 28 Aug 09
A canal is a canal when it connects 2 waterways. Suez Canal--Panama etc. I cannot see where the canal links to any other waterway either end. To my mind that simply means it is no more than a giant multi million pound body of water. Surely on that basis the cheaper option is to build a big goldfish pond? The Mechanics was a beautiful building inside and out which is in an area of our history with a close passageway to the outlet village where the council has sanctioned further loss of our rail heritage in allowing housing stifling any growth of steam etc--that is how our council thinks. The people cry out for investment in Coate which has been neglected--that is council strategy as it leaves the door open to build on.
Mr_Big
says...
12:59pm Fri 28 Aug 09
BadProspects wrote:There you have it folks. What more needs to be said.
Hahaha! You seem to have completely missed the double standards of that which you accuse (but don't let posting an off-topic comment put you off your stride either) .... I repeat back to you your own words as they apply equally to you: ... "If you don’t agree with my thoughts – I don’t care, I am entitled to my opinion and will not be deterred or bullied from doing so. If you can’t use this forum properly, please do not use it at all. " Throwing a hissy because I called you *a troll* (how insulting!) because of YOUR rude reply to itsamess hardly demonstrates your status as an 'adult' does it? Or am I missing some special status which exempts you when it comes to manners? ;-) Back ON topic - fact remains that the canal will only be joined at one end - meaning it literally IS a cul-de-sac for at least the next 20 years
"because of YOUR rude reply to itsamess.." - you big baby, save your t it for tat to the playground.
Back ON topic - fact remains that the canal will only be joined at one end, meaning it will be a great start to the project. I can wait 20 years for it to be finished, better than nothing at all.
Ardiles
says...
1:13pm Fri 28 Aug 09
---
The present town centre is a text book example of what happens when you try to build something on the cheap. A canal would attract further investment and bring people in to the town who currently would not consider going there.
---
Another tired argument used by opponents of the scheme is that a canal would simply fill up with trolleys; that it would become an eyesore. The perfect counterargument is just 40 miles up the road in Reading. No trolleys; no eyesore. Just an attractive water feature along the banks of which have been built bars, restaurants, a cinema and a shopping centre.
---
It will take a little imagination, but the centre of Swindon could be SO much better than it currently is. Something like this needs to happen - or there will come a point in the not too distant future where Swindon becomes the kind of town that aspirational, young people feel they have to leave if they want to get on in life.
Casual Observer
says...
1:23pm Fri 28 Aug 09
Another classic Bobism.
Bobfm
says...
1:26pm Fri 28 Aug 09
What I can say on behalf of UKIP Swindon, if we were elected or held the balance of power in SBC we would give the people of Swindon a referendum which would deal with several major issues involving regeneration/develop
ment.
1. A new Concert Venue.
2. A Canal
3. A say on housing and density.
4. The Town Centre.
5. An Elected Mayor.
Of course the list could be added to.
BadProspects
says...
1:40pm Fri 28 Aug 09
It's no good comparing Swindon to towns which bear no relation historically, geographically or demographically. Its as irrelevent as saying that Bath has excellent ancient Roman baths and trying to use that as logical reason to build a faux Roman bath here.
Itasamess - I couldn't agree with you more: "A dead ended stretch of water is not a canal - its a ditch...". Those were the words of one of the canal's main proponents! Swindon's canal is gone, dead, literally buried. Rather than trying a poor man's copy, yet again, of the achievements of other towns (with yet another miguided 'knock it all down, rebuild it all again' project) we'd be much better off trying to do something with what we've actually got!
What about a project with something to do with the one bit of meaningful historical heritage this town has - the railway?
Bobby Bee
says...
1:43pm Fri 28 Aug 09
Ardiles wrote:An inspiring comment here.
It is widely accepted that the centre of town needs a radical overhaul - so I am surprised at the number of supporters for the status quo. The canal sounds like a promising development. Yes - an expensive one. But things worth having generally do cost money. --- The present town centre is a text book example of what happens when you try to build something on the cheap. A canal would attract further investment and bring people in to the town who currently would not consider going there. --- Another tired argument used by opponents of the scheme is that a canal would simply fill up with trolleys; that it would become an eyesore. The perfect counterargument is just 40 miles up the road in Reading. No trolleys; no eyesore. Just an attractive water feature along the banks of which have been built bars, restaurants, a cinema and a shopping centre. --- It will take a little imagination, but the centre of Swindon could be SO much better than it currently is. Something like this needs to happen - or there will come a point in the not too distant future where Swindon becomes the kind of town that aspirational, young people feel they have to leave if they want to get on in life.
You may be right.
Gloucester saw regeneration via docks and canal.
BadProspects
says...
2:00pm Fri 28 Aug 09
...and all these places had an existing canal infrastructure which did not involve widescale compulsary purchases and demolition, re-routing of roads, re-routing of services...
... and all these places have interesting architecture and/or a meaningful historical link to the canals, like the docks or The Severn or local industry (Swindon's canal was hardly used even during its brief heyday)
Its weird that we have ended up with a second rate uninspiring town simply and directly BECAUSE all sorts of ill considered 'vibrant and imaginitive' plans weren't subject to scrutiny and scepticism. The whole current town centre was actually built by people who brushed aside the concerns of others!! It didn't work, did it?
A canal which doesn't provide a route from somewhere to somewhere won't attract boats or users. It becomes a very long and VERY expensive pond.
This is a 30 year+ vague gamble which at the very best gives us... well, what? The poorer version of what our regional competitors Reading, Bath, Bristol etc have already got.
Concept = FAIL!
Mr_Big
says...
2:10pm Fri 28 Aug 09
BadProspects wrote:"Itasamess - I couldn't agree with you more: "
The town centre was described as 'imaginitive' 20 years ago when they trashed the Victoriana and built the Chavolpolis. In 20 years time, the 'imaginitive' one-way, trolley filled canal will look no better. The only people it'll benefit will be the property owners and developers who can put 'canalside' on their sign-boards... It's no good comparing Swindon to towns which bear no relation historically, geographically or demographically. Its as irrelevent as saying that Bath has excellent ancient Roman baths and trying to use that as logical reason to build a faux Roman bath here. Itasamess - I couldn't agree with you more: "A dead ended stretch of water is not a canal - its a ditch...". Those were the words of one of the canal's main proponents! Swindon's canal is gone, dead, literally buried. Rather than trying a poor man's copy, yet again, of the achievements of other towns (with yet another miguided 'knock it all down, rebuild it all again' project) we'd be much better off trying to do something with what we've actually got! What about a project with something to do with the one bit of meaningful historical heritage this town has - the railway?
What a surprise! You need to start thinking for yourself, one would envisage that it is not possible for you though…
You are quick to criticise the council on any issue but your ideas are totally unfeasible.
Reading, Bath, Bristol etc are NOT regional competitors! They happen to be neighbouring city’s. Why don’t you move to Bath and stop knocking Swindon all the time.
Home Boy
says...
2:18pm Fri 28 Aug 09
__
Alternatively we could just throw all of our resources at trying to convince Debenhams to build a bigger department store and getting Costa to open a few more of those lovely coffee shops...
itsamess
says...
2:40pm Fri 28 Aug 09
People on these sites do invariably use their basic right to form an opinion on any matter that is raised. Unlike yourself who use these pages to raise your political views. Sadly your political views do not interest the majority as we are more concerned as to learn what actually goes on with our Council and the plans they put forward in the vague hope they will listen to the peoples views--a cross section of views. You take umbrage easily and like others choose to attack them and accuse them of being the instigater.We prefer personal views rather than party politics. There is no realistic prospect of your party gaining seats on our Council or as our MP. Some of us bobby are actually doing something positive about our council and do learn from our experiences here. Many posts are stopped simply when clear abuse takes place that goes beyond reason and uncalled for. I do not aim that comment at you--but you do often enter into arguments with numerous folk on here.
Casual Observer
says...
2:48pm Fri 28 Aug 09
itsamess
says...
3:17pm Fri 28 Aug 09
If i was alone in my criticism of the council i would be concerned--therefore i am not. My business takes me to many cities and towns and i take time to look around to see what is there for the people before i invest. I have been in swindon most of my life and have seen most of our greatest assetts destroyed by successive councils. We have a council who prefer to employ out of town workers which shows lack of faith in our workforce--we see contracts given to out of town companies denying our own people the chance to expand. Money from sales which should have been used to develop swindon ploughed into pension funds and the likes of. Swindon can be a great town--but it takes a council that can get the balance right and the non stop building of houses and hotels is not the answer when everything else is falling apart around us. Why do we have so many office blocks empty? Why do we have so many factories closed? Trading estates half empty? Shops boarded up? We want a town to be proud of as its our home--we have the land and we have the sites that if restored or developed and viable projects taken on we would be on the road to recovery--that is in our Councils hands and if they do not listen and continue on the downward spiral we will simply continue to be a third rate town.
BadProspects
says...
3:46pm Fri 28 Aug 09
BWB
says...
3:47pm Fri 28 Aug 09
After all I am taking a risk giving it to you.Perhaps you would rather sqabble amongst yourselves.I give up.
http://video.google.
com/videoplay?docid=
2748614967389038944&
hl=en
itsamess
says...
4:22pm Fri 28 Aug 09
Not sure of the significance of that link as its all about the funny handshake brigade?
I Too
says...
5:15pm Fri 28 Aug 09
3:17pm Fri 28 Aug 09
Mr Big
If I was alone in my criticism of the council I would be concerned--therefore i am not.
Ditto, Councillor Big.
I wait for the personal onslaught of childish remarks now?
Bobby Bee
says...
6:11pm Fri 28 Aug 09
Please tell us your pseudonym in previous postings (before you assumed your present one).
Bobby Bee
says...
6:13pm Fri 28 Aug 09
PS My friend works there....
IMO
says...
8:42pm Fri 28 Aug 09
BWB
says...
7:29am Sat 29 Aug 09
itsamess wrote:
BWB Not sure of the significance of that link as its all about the funny handshake brigade?
Say no more.
Thats how contracts are obtained.
Nothing to do with lowest tender.
Its who you know.(be cautious)
Bobfm
says...
9:09am Sat 29 Aug 09
My comments about Referenda was based on the notion that 'real' local democracy can be achieved, political or otherwise, do not wish the people to be asked what they want. Perhaps you suggested another way, perhaps an Advertiser poll, of the dozen or so posters. That would certainly be interesting :).
I Too
says...
11:50am Sat 29 Aug 09
So it's nice to see there is constructive debate itsamess.
It seems rather bizarre to me that in the last local elections the voters, effectively removed all opposition to the ruling group, after many of you posting what a rubbish council we have on these pages. Immediately after electing more Tory Councillors you all return to posting what a rubbish council we have.
`
I continually rubbish the council (it's not difficult), then I vote for anything, but Labour or Tory, then I continue to rubbish the council.
Nothing stated there, gives rise to my political preference.
To quote Itsamess
Unlike yourself who use these pages to raise your political views. Sadly your political views do not interest the majority as we are more concerned as to learn what actually goes on with our Council and the plans they put forward in the vague hope they will listen to the peoples views.
Been to The Pride or Mela lately?
Bobfm
says...
1:18pm Sat 29 Aug 09
In answer to your question, Nope, and I would guess 95% of Swindon wouldn't go they not free. Well not actually free, subsidised out of rate payers money.
But what has that got to do with the people of Swindon having a say in how the money is spent. Was anyone asked if they minded these events being sponsored by SBC.
I think you perhaps ought to read how one Mayor is about to slash Council Tax, sack half his Councillors and disband 'Diversity' departments and simpler divisive set ups., etc, and no he is not BNP. What he is is incredibly popular.
itsamess
says...
1:41pm Sat 29 Aug 09
I am relatively new to these pages and unlike you i have no affinity to any political group. In local elections i vote for the candidate i believe would serve my ward best. Unfortunately i live in one of the safe seats where the councillors ignore generally what the local folk ask of them--unless of course they are a group of party supporters. Some Councillors are up for re-election next year and i expect some changes. Sadly the voters do not turn out--therefore we do not get a true picture. We have been helped this year by revelations of what goes on in parliament--and in our council. The people of Swindon have voiced their feelings and although some temporary measures have been taken to appease these concerns we know that is politically motivated as there will be a general election. We are not a true democracy as we delegate the power to our councillors and MPs who then ignore their constituents and follow party lines. We should have the right to choose our leaders. As with many things--i listen to what others say here. Yes even some of the rantings let out pieces of the puzzle. What am i doing to get the Council to engage with what the people want--i can only give you a clue at this time. What would you do if you had copies of 2 sets of documents-one that showed all the correct procedures were taken--the other clearly showing they had not. One under a labour council--the other under a tory council. Wait and see Bob. Past errors covered up by senior councillors cannot be overlooked and now we are bombarded by super duper plans-the canal--sure after the route will have had spent 4 millions refurbishing just part of the route--yet realistically there is no waterways to link it too?Wooton Bassett has a small stretch of canal used for leisure--but its not running through the town. Why dont the council want a university on hawksworth--they have set it aside for the snowdome--or so it seems. Same with Coate--safe? Far from it. All i am seeing is electioneering. Lots of promises and spin--the excuses will come after the election. As i have said before the so called regeneration wa lauded when the brunel sale went ahead--let the people decide was the claim--yes--then most of the money was used for pensions and the rest never explained. Downhill ever since. So yes Bob the few of us prepared to dig deeper can bring some of the truth out and explain why swindon is failing so badly--the people let them get away with it.
cyclingpilot
says...
8:29pm Sat 29 Aug 09
Bobfm
says...
10:57am Mon 31 Aug 09
As my Grandfather would say, 'tell the truth and shame the devil'.
I Too
says...
12:34pm Mon 31 Aug 09
I'll vote UKIP.
Happy now?
Now don't keep on.
Have your new neighbours moved in yet?
Billy-o says...
11:24pm Thu 27 Aug 09
If we can raise £75m, spend it on something with at least a vague sense of the 21st century. Concert hall, anyone?