Labour Party to choose new candidate (From Swindon Advertiser)

Adver courting controversy by allowing a 'Have You Say' to this article. Playing fun and games with politics again.

All you will get is opposition correspondents writing their usual. I hope that the moderators will remove totally crass and insulting comments, which will inevitably be forthcoming, though I doubt it as the newspaper is mischievious in which stories it allows comment on?

This is currently a matter for the Labour Party in North Swindon and until a name comes forward as candidate, it is a bit unfair to accept derogatory comments.

Just getting in first as you know it will happen.

There we have if from staunch socialist Donkey. Censorship not democracy.

He is of course right that traditionally the Adver restricts comments in involving his beloved Labour MP's, or pulls them when things get a bit 'hot'.

However, I would just point out that Labour only have a relatively few card carrying members in Swindon, so he is happy to deny the thousands of other traditional Labour voters a say on who should stand or at least express a view.

Very democratic. Didn't the Tories allow any voter to select a candidate several on the voters register several times on the South Coast.

Let's be honest Donkey it really is quite academic who is selected, they are not going to be elected.

Donkey...
Seems odd that the Adver's sister paper ,The Gazette & Herald, invite comments on EVERY article printed, but Mr King only allows those he deems "safe" in a "non provocative response only" manner.
And as for the Islam4U comments....ALL were allowed and their comments page, unlike the Adver's, wasn't up and down like a bride's nightie !! ( sw slow-wife...chortle)

Cllr Montaut, this is not a Labour town; it's not a Tory town either - it's split.

Personally, neither fill me with any confidence and I'll be looking elsewhere to place my vote come May/June or whenever the election is.

peatmoor pirate wrote:
Cllr Montaut, this is not a Labour town; it's not a Tory town either - it's split. Personally, neither fill me with any confidence and I'll be looking elsewhere to place my vote come May/June or whenever the election is.

I totally agree. You can tell if labour / Tory candidates are lying. You can see their lips moving.
I'll be voting for an independant, or a minority group

I Too wrote:

peatmoor pirate wrote:
Cllr Montaut, this is not a Labour town; it's not a Tory town either - it's split. Personally, neither fill me with any confidence and I'll be looking elsewhere to place my vote come May/June or whenever the election is.

I totally agree. You can tell if labour / Tory candidates are lying. You can see their lips moving.
I'll be voting for an independant, or a minority group

Independent and minority groups are a waste of time (and a vote). Just look at boobys beloved UKIP, what have they achieved - squat - nothing just a complete waste of time and money. All they have succeeded in doing is making themselves look stupid and irrelevant!
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It won't be long before the Tories are in power and they will stop the rot that is for sure!!

I do not reply to Wurzelly, Brizzley, Prattley, or Saddo-ley. as he only comments, with very limited agenda, to certain posters, with the sole motive to cause aggrovation.
If anyone, who is not obsessed with Bob cares to comment on any issue he has raised, I will of course enter into an adult debate with them.

I'm afraid i'm with Wurzelly on this one....
GREEN/BNP/UKIP etc will never get a shot at making any difference to the political landscape for two reasons...
1) Lack of any real defined policies across the political spectrum. They may be strong in one or two areas but until the electorate can be convinced that they are not "one-trick ponies" they are doomed to fail, as has already been shown.
2) These parties are usually full of amateur wannabe politicians who are usually only interested in self promotion. I am aware that the main parties have there fair share of "blowhards" but they at least seem to have some semblance of balance.
It's a little unfortunate that these minor parties hit the nail on the head with a populist political subject that appeal to the base instinct of some in an attempt to garner a few votes but I do wish they would not detract from the seriousness of proper politics.
If Lord Pearson, Nick Griffin or Caroline Lucas had the ability to make ANY real impact on the political stage do we not think that one of the "big three" would turn to them for advice on their core policies?

Billy Jo wrote:
I'm afraid i'm with Wurzelly on this one....
GREEN/BNP/UKIP etc will never get a shot at making any difference to the political landscape for two reasons...
1) Lack of any real defined policies across the political spectrum. They may be strong in one or two areas but until the electorate can be convinced that they are not "one-trick ponies" they are doomed to fail, as has already been shown.
2) These parties are usually full of amateur wannabe politicians who are usually only interested in self promotion. I am aware that the main parties have there fair share of "blowhards" but they at least seem to have some semblance of balance.
It's a little unfortunate that these minor parties hit the nail on the head with a populist political subject that appeal to the base instinct of some in an attempt to garner a few votes but I do wish they would not detract from the seriousness of proper politics.
If Lord Pearson, Nick Griffin or Caroline Lucas had the ability to make ANY real impact on the political stage do we not think that one of the "big three" would turn to them for advice on their core policies?

Good comment. See agreeing with me isn't all that painful ;-)

It's some councillor from Surrey. Don't bother moving mate.

I Too wrote:
I do not reply to Wurzelly, Brizzley, Prattley, or Saddo-ley. as he only comments, with very limited agenda, to certain posters, with the sole motive to cause aggrovation.
If anyone, who is not obsessed with Bob cares to comment on any issue he has raised, I will of course enter into an adult debate with them.

Hang on a minute ..... you have made plenty of derogatory comments (i.e. replies) to my previous posts what has changed sweetheart?
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It is true though I only post on subject matters that interest me. So if that is an agenda then so be it!

Billy Jo, I have to agree, that a minority party is very unlikely to actually come to power.
However there are a great many people that no longer vote, as they feel that politicians do not represent their point of view. Worse still they also do not trust politicians, due to expenses scandals and grotesque salaries etc.
The non voters would do well to at least vote for a minority party, or independant candidate.
A massive surge in voting for these candidates would at least send a messege to Westminster, that the public have had enough.

Rusty23 wrote:
It's some councillor from Surrey. Don't bother moving mate.

I wonder if they are claiming their trip to Swindon as a legitimate expense?
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Surrey is a hell of a drive for a finger buffet in the moredon community centre, surely they could have found somewhere more salubrious!

I Too wrote:
Billy Jo, I have to agree, that a minority party is very unlikely to actually come to power.
However there are a great many people that no longer vote, as they feel that politicians do not represent their point of view. Worse still they also do not trust politicians, due to expenses scandals and grotesque salaries etc.
The non voters would do well to at least vote for a minority party, or independant candidate.
A massive surge in voting for these candidates would at least send a messege to Westminster, that the public have had enough.

You are implying that it is OK to vote for someone that you know to be incapable of holding office due to one principled campaigning point!
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That argument is somewhat flawed!!!

Billy Jo wrote:
I'm afraid i'm with Wurzelly on this one....
GREEN/BNP/UKIP etc will never get a shot at making any difference to the political landscape for two reasons...
1) Lack of any real defined policies across the political spectrum. They may be strong in one or two areas but until the electorate can be convinced that they are not "one-trick ponies" they are doomed to fail, as has already been shown.
2) These parties are usually full of amateur wannabe politicians who are usually only interested in self promotion. I am aware that the main parties have there fair share of "blowhards" but they at least seem to have some semblance of balance.
It's a little unfortunate that these minor parties hit the nail on the head with a populist political subject that appeal to the base instinct of some in an attempt to garner a few votes but I do wish they would not detract from the seriousness of proper politics.
If Lord Pearson, Nick Griffin or Caroline Lucas had the ability to make ANY real impact on the political stage do we not think that one of the "big three" would turn to them for advice on their core policies?

Well said Billy Jo - not having a go at Bob here but he says the big three copy policies from UKIP et al. Fair enough in my book, as long as they only take the good bits (if there are any) and discard the nonsense, like trying to bring back smoking.

Billy Jo, I suggest you go to ukip.org, click on the policy link on the left. UKIP has a full range of policies, many of which have been copied by the major parties. The difference of course is UKIP will deliver on those policies, unlike 'Call me Dave'. Did you know that 3/4 of the Tory council disagree with 'call me Dave' on major policies areas, and that includes their two PPC's, which of course they will deny.

Bobfm wrote:
Billy Jo, I suggest you go to ukip.org, click on the policy link on the left. UKIP has a full range of policies, many of which have been copied by the major parties. The difference of course is UKIP will deliver on those policies, unlike 'Call me Dave'. Did you know that 3/4 of the Tory council disagree with 'call me Dave' on major policies areas, and that includes their two PPC's, which of course they will deny.

It's very easy for UKIP to make promises and polices because they know they will never have to keep them.
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They will never get into power as 99% of the general public see them for what they are either:
a) disaffected tories that believe their party is not far enough to the right
b) far right activists that see the BNP as a step too far

Seems to me that labour are ceding this seat. Few if any have any confidence in this govt who have only succeeded in increasing public sector jobs 6 fold--turned our police into revenue collectors and councils into parking enforcers. They have destroyed the social life of the local public houses etc with lunatic policies causing pubs and working peoples social clubs to close wholesale and have in their sights the final nail in the coffin by increasing drink 4 fold. What next--will they adopt the chinese 1 child policy--or execution for corrupt politicians or govt officials. We are now worse off than the communist countries who can still enjoy the basic freedoms we cant. Will it get better with another govt--not a hope in hell.

Voting is never a waste of time. Voting for a minority party is not a wast of time - the only waste of time is voting for someone who you don't want because you think no-one else will get in.

I say vote for the party/independent who best represents your own views - at least you will be true to yourselves.

Bobfm wrote:
Billy Jo, I suggest you go to ukip.org, click on the policy link on the left. UKIP has a full range of policies, many of which have been copied by the major parties. The difference of course is UKIP will deliver on those policies, unlike 'Call me Dave'. Did you know that 3/4 of the Tory council disagree with 'call me Dave' on major policies areas, and that includes their two PPC's, which of course they will deny.

Bobfm.... I did. And there were one or two policies that I did indeed agree with. However as I stated in my previous post unfortunately there seems to be a substantial number of policies that do not hold creedence or water.
UKIP have already proven to be a pale imitation of the "big three" in that they have also had there share of members who indulged in a little skullduggery.
No I was not aware that 3/4 of the Conservative council and the two PPC's were against Mr. Camerons policies. I take it you can substantiate these claims with facts of which I am sure we would be very interested in.
Mores the point I think the whole town have been a little unhappy with the way our two current MP's have voted with the Government on every subject, regardless of their own opinion (if they had any). I welcome debate and free votes on any policy/subject and I truly believe the Conservative whip will not be as stringent as the dictatorship that has become the norm under Labour.

peatmoor pirate wrote:
Voting is never a waste of time. Voting for a minority party is not a wast of time - the only waste of time is voting for someone who you don't want because you think no-one else will get in. I say vote for the party/independent who best represents your own views - at least you will be true to yourselves.

That's exactly the point I was making earlier.
Most people vote for the lesser of two evils. They will vote Tory this year, because they have had enough of this government. The Tories will definitely not be the answer to everyones' prayers.
Many more will not vote at all, because parliament has lost touch with the majority of the population.
Others feel their vote will not change anything.
The people who have chosen not to vote, for these reasons would benefit the country greatly, by voting for the smaller parties or for independant candidates

You have to love the excuses Politicians come out with.
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Why can't they just tell the truth?
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It would be different to say the least.
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Instead of Wills saying he shouldn't serve more than 3 terms, why not admit that he is 57 years old and he knows that;
(a) Labour will probably lose Swindon N at the next election and even if they don't,
(b) they will lose the election, and be out of power for at least 10 yearts, God willing.
.
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Even if he manages to be in parliament when and if Labour ever win again, he will be at least 67, and be competing for ministerial jobs against people 40 years younger.
I

Billy Jo, some very senior 'horses mouths'. As for expenses etc. That has been well done. Fact Tom Wise stopped being a UKIP MEP in 2007 as soon as the party became aware of the allegations. Fact Ashley Mote never took his seat as a UKIP MEP after being convicted of a DHSS fraud, shortly after being elected, nothing to do with politics. He was again chucked out of the Europe group.

As for policies, you may not agree with some but, as to credence and water, 2.7 million people in June last year, (23% of them in Swindon) did.

It also has to be said that both seats in Swindon were won on just a 3% majority. UKIP Swindon has consistently shown it is capable of achieving a high percentage of votes in Swindon pushing the Lib Dems well into third place. So if the people of Swindon really wanted a change locally they could have one by voting UKIP.

That should ne 4th place of course

Oh , come on, Wurzelly:
"Surrey is a hell of a drive for a finger buffet in the moredon community centre, surely they could have found somewhere more salubrious!"

This IS the party of the working classes, after all!!
Cue Bliar , Mandy , Lord Sainsbury , the Ginger Pillock ,Harperson,The Minister for Data Loss etc ,etc , etc!

OK , FAIR POINT!

Bobfm wrote:
Billy Jo, some very senior 'horses mouths'. As for expenses etc. That has been well done. Fact Tom Wise stopped being a UKIP MEP in 2007 as soon as the party became aware of the allegations. Fact Ashley Mote never took his seat as a UKIP MEP after being convicted of a DHSS fraud, shortly after being elected, nothing to do with politics. He was again chucked out of the Europe group. As for policies, you may not agree with some but, as to credence and water, 2.7 million people in June last year, (23% of them in Swindon) did. It also has to be said that both seats in Swindon were won on just a 3% majority. UKIP Swindon has consistently shown it is capable of achieving a high percentage of votes in Swindon pushing the Lib Dems well into third place. So if the people of Swindon really wanted a change locally they could have one by voting UKIP.

Rumours from "horses mouths" mean nothing to the people who seek out fact.
On your advice I did indeed look up the UKIP website but cannot find a reference to the number of MP's,MEP's or councillors. During a little further research I have found some sketchy numbers but it seems quite a few of UKIP's members were not elected on a UKIP mandate but were defectors from other parties with whom they had fallen out with.
As far as I am aware the only MP UKIP have ever had was Bob Spink who defected from the Conservatives and then 8 months later became an Independant.
For all the ruses and smokescreens used by minor parties the facts remain the same... UKIP,BNP and The Green Party have no representation in the national government and it is unlikely that unless they benefit from the odd defector the never will.
Both seats in Swindon were won with a majority of 3%. So what % of the vote did UKIP receive?
To be frank,at present UKIP hope to scale the lofty heights of the Lib-Dems who themselves have no chance of acheiving any real power.

Have we all gone mad? The reason Labour got in with a landslide in the 90's was because we were all so appalled by the last reign of the Tories. The only reason these other parties stay on the fringes is because we never get off our butts and vote for them. Why? The two main parties tell us it is a wasted vote or they scare us with words like 'hung' parliament - when the real word is 'coalition goverment' and many countries govern successfully with them all over the world. Honestly - our voting pattern is like watching a cycle of abuse. Break the cycle and vote with your heart for a change. You may be surprised at the amount of talent and fresh ideas that are lurking in parties like UKIP and the Green Party.

MHayworth wrote:
Have we all gone mad? The reason Labour got in with a landslide in the 90's was because we were all so appalled by the last reign of the Tories. The only reason these other parties stay on the fringes is because we never get off our butts and vote for them. Why? The two main parties tell us it is a wasted vote or they scare us with words like 'hung' parliament - when the real word is 'coalition goverment' and many countries govern successfully with them all over the world. Honestly - our voting pattern is like watching a cycle of abuse. Break the cycle and vote with your heart for a change. You may be surprised at the amount of talent and fresh ideas that are lurking in parties like UKIP and the Green Party.

Surely if there were that much talent it would have been recognised by now and these political minnows would have grown.

Billy Jo,
I don't agree. The big parties have the money and for the most part, they own the media. We hear exactly what they want us to hear. A perfect example is the comment that the smaller parties are one-issue groups that don't have any other policies and are therefore not ready or capable of governing. I've read that for years and yet you just need to look on thier websites to see it is completely untrue.

The fact is that these parties are made up of those who leave the bigger parties often because the concept of the whip stops them from representing their beliefs and those of their communities. So, in my view, they are often made up of politicians who still have a conscience. Not a bad thing given the current state of affairs. The point being, that we will never know if we don't step out or our comfort zone.

Lets face it, so many experienced MPs from all three main parties (particularly the Tories) are stepping down before the election, so no matter who we vote for, there will be a lot of inexperienced politicians running the country later this year.

My apologies for being a little brash but I have read the UKIP website,and the BNP website and have even attempted to plough through the Green Party website and apart from their glaringly obvious policies there really seems to be no real substance in anything they have to say apart from their core policy.
Trying to glean some information on how any of the fringe parties would handle the NHS is impossible. All three seem to cobble together a few comments but then drift back to their staple ideal.
I give the electorate a little more credit in that I believe they are educated enough to realise that the "big three" will sometimes use spin over substance but at least they have some substance.
As for the whip, the three main parties use it to retain order and set out their mandate. As we have seen in the past,any MP who decides he/she is not happy with the policies or manifesto of their party is free to leave at any time and still be able to represent their ward.
Assuming their point of view of is supported by the local electorate they would soon be re-elected.
Judging by how few defectors there are we have to assume that the vast majority of MP's are happy with the way that their party is being run and are happy to remain a part of it.
In addition,judging by the amount of resignations and those not wishing to stand at the forthcoming election it is safe to say that many Labour MP's are indeed dissatisfied with their party. Hence the person chosen to fight Mr Wills soon to be vacant seat has to be brought in from outside the ward.

The three party mix we've been voting in for decades has brought us health and education systems that couldn't compete abroad, a 'criminal is the victim' judicial system, an EU health and safety regime that have made us behave as though all activities are unsafe, a benefits system that creates benefit dependency, a dependence on foreign oil that makes us kneel to countries whose human rights records we abhor, a population level that is entirely unsustainable, and an immigration system that has abandoned the concept of 'integration for the sake of cohesion'.

This has been happening slowly since the 60's, so all three parties have been complicit.

And STILL there has been no real breakthrough from the fringe parties.

MHayworth wrote:
The three party mix we've been voting in for decades has brought us health and education systems that couldn't compete abroad, a 'criminal is the victim' judicial system, an EU health and safety regime that have made us behave as though all activities are unsafe, a benefits system that creates benefit dependency, a dependence on foreign oil that makes us kneel to countries whose human rights records we abhor, a population level that is entirely unsustainable, and an immigration system that has abandoned the concept of 'integration for the sake of cohesion'. This has been happening slowly since the 60's, so all three parties have been complicit.

Billy Jo.
It's all very well picking holes in the smaller parties wbsites.
The main parties may well have a superior glossy website, but those websites will be full of inevitably false promises.
The smaller parties may look a little rough around the edges, but at least they are striving to break the mould.
The mould that has given us a corrupt democracy, of deceitful, egotistical, politicians.
The country is hardly in a proud shape at present. There is no way a harsh Conservative government is going to make the majority of people any happier.

I Too wrote:

MHayworth wrote: The three party mix we've been voting in for decades has brought us health and education systems that couldn't compete abroad, a 'criminal is the victim' judicial system, an EU health and safety regime that have made us behave as though all activities are unsafe, a benefits system that creates benefit dependency, a dependence on foreign oil that makes us kneel to countries whose human rights records we abhor, a population level that is entirely unsustainable, and an immigration system that has abandoned the concept of 'integration for the sake of cohesion'. This has been happening slowly since the 60's, so all three parties have been complicit.

Billy Jo. It's all very well picking holes in the smaller parties wbsites. The main parties may well have a superior glossy website, but those websites will be full of inevitably false promises. The smaller parties may look a little rough around the edges, but at least they are striving to break the mould. The mould that has given us a corrupt democracy, of deceitful, egotistical, politicians. The country is hardly in a proud shape at present. There is no way a harsh Conservative government is going to make the majority of people any happier.

Sorry I Too. I have no intention of trying to pick holes in the minor parties websites. The holes slap you in the face the moment you look at them.
IF they are serious about trying to get elected then surely they need to at least get some facts on their sites.
I have no wish to see pretty colours and flashing images on any site,just some facts.
Unfortunately these sites seem very thin on the ground with fact. It does not take a great deal of money to fill the pages with ideas/policies rather than the clap trap that already exists.

Well, if you want more of the same, you are certainly welcome to it. If we stay in the EU, it won't matter which puppet government sits in Westminster anyway.

MHayworth wrote:
Well, if you want more of the same, you are certainly welcome to it. If we stay in the EU, it won't matter which puppet government sits in Westminster anyway.

Wanting more of the same is not really an option. It is what we are going to end up with until someone comes up with a viable alternative which at the moment seems to be a long way off.

the comments about the adver are on line, if you dont have praise for the looney left, then your not even considered, Mr Wills has seen the writing on the wall, and I wouldnt bet he has been told that his seat in the lords is already ready for him, as for prudence, this is the man who gave praise to both Mr Jones and his sidekick Mr Kitson, and both have now been exposed as communist spies of one sort or another, I expect he'll be giving them knighthoods next, as he did with Fred the Shed Goodwin, for services to banking, and you can see what he did to the RBS and others, and this week we read that banks are still paying out bonus schemes and the government has taken in 2 billion pounds in taxes from these same bonus payments, any wonder why they have not been stopped........

Perhaps proportional representation would be the way to go. I have always voted for the party I believe to have the best policies in my opinion, even though I know they do not have a good chance of getting a seat, but I know many people dont as they would considered it a 'wasted ' vote. I think if we had proportional representation that would change this and people would vote more honestly.

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